Conventional motor oil & Torco ZEP addition

[HondaFan81]

Personally, for a DD/non-project CB7 I am a fan of using conventional 5W30 motor oil (Valvoline). I drive mostly highway, change it every 7,000 miles. This has served me well for my DD and several other family cars for 1XX,XXX of miles.

However, our valvetrains/tappet-type do benefit from oils with zinc additives. I know and have used Torco ZEP with conventional motor oils. It's 12.95/bottle and 12 oz. container. I use 4 quarts conventional Valvoline 5W30 with 1 ZEP container.

http://www.torcousa.com/Products/Pro...pe=Maintenance

I am a believer of good synthetics, but for our F22 valvetrains most synthetics do not have the zinc additives. I used Mobil1 5W30 for my red Accord project, it kept motor clean, but no zinc. Basically, you spend more money and it does not give you the protection you really need.

(Typical conv. oil change) 5 quarts Conv. Valvoline (~ $3.99/ea) = ~$20.00

(Alternative, better protection) 4 quarts Conv. Valvoline 5W30 (~ $3.99/ea) + $12.95 Torco ZEP = ~$29.00

(Typical synthetic oil change) 5 quarts Mobil1 5W30 (~$6.99/ea) = ~$35.00

(Better synthetic oil change) 5 quarts Torco SR-1 5W30 (~$8.50/ea) = ~$42.50


I believe it is the better alternative for DD/mild project cars. It is about $9.00 more than a conventional oil change, but $6.00/$13.50 less than synthetic and has the protection you need.


Thoughts?...

NOTE: For higher performance builds, I'd use Torco synthetic motor oils. I will use SR-1 5W30 in my white Accord project at 3,000 motor miles. Currently, using the alternative option above until then.

[19dabeast85]

I've always been a fan of Castrol synthetic blend oils and is what I use for my wife' Taurus. I think you are dead on as far as functionality for the average driver....a cheaper conventional oil is fine, just add the zinc. However I would change it more often than every 7,000....especially for most here with 175,000+ miles. The best way to know when to change your oil is to send in oil analysis to determine how used your oil is....every engine and driving style will be different.

I'm currently in the process of comparing Mobil1 supersyn to Royal Purple to Torco SR-1 along with comparing the Purolator PureOne filter against Amsoil and Royal Purple synthetic media filters. So far Royal Purple is much superior to Mobile1 as far as engine wear but it should be noted that similar results could probably be had with a zinc additive instead of paying close to $9 per quart for Royal Purple. A couple hundred more miles till I have 6,000 on the Royal Purple with Amsoil filter and I'm changing to Torco SR-1 and Royal Purple filter. I'm using 6,000 mile change intervals and blackstone labs to test my oil.

[HondaFan81]

19dabeast85,

I'm familiar with Blackstone labs, we've used them at my work, basic oil analysis.

There is no problems changing oil every 7,000 miles, especially for mostly HWY driving. Newer Hondas are every 7,500 miles now, like my wife's 2003 Element and I use conventional Valvoline 5W30. The oil looks great for 7,500 miles.

I partially agree with changing it at earlier intervals, but on unhealthy motors. Motors that have piston ring blowby will get fuel into the oil and such, breaking it down. Another issue is if the motor is running hotter than normal causing higher oil temps, not good. Considering issues such as these, you would have to change oil sooner or rebuild/swap the motor.

Mileage to me is a generality, but if the engine was properly taken care of it will last a long time. Running the combination I mentioned would be fine throughout life, as long as motor remains healthy.

[19dabeast85]

I agree, healthier engines can definitely run longer drain intervals. I know that my F22 will turn brand new oil dark in 1,000 miles though which is why I'm running oil analysis and testing different brands and drain intervals. Note though that my oil has always tested at 0.0% for fuel or coolant content so I'm not sure why the oil turns dark so quickly unless the synthetic is still cleaning up the passages from 189,000 miles of conventional oil....

I currently have 232,000 miles on the engine, I've been running either Mobile1 or Royal Purple since 189,500 when I got the car, both of which have excellent cleaning properties, and this is what the bottom end looked like at 220,000 miles: (all these miles with 3-4k drain intervals)

[19dabeast85]

Just wanted to add that I have changed the oil on other vehicles that were relatively new and with 3,000 miles on the oil, I could still see through the stream pouring out of the pan(still golden colored oil)......extremely clean running engine. Even though the engine was running very clean it is still important to make sure the flash point and lubricity of your particular oil type can stand up to the extended drain intervals.

[HondaFan81]

Even though the engine was running very clean it is still important to make sure the flash point and lubricity of your particular oil type can stand up to the extended drain intervals.

True, but a good oil will not breakdown if the motor is healthy and operating temperature remains normal at 7K mile intervals.

Your bottom end definitely has a good amount of carburization. Try running a cleaning agent solution (i.e. Lucas products or similar) through your engine at idle with a cheaper oil. Then, let it sit, idle it again until fully warm and drain while warm. Change oil filter and put in a better oil and keep it up. That should clean up your engine quicker, than running a better oil and changing 3-4K miles.

Also, what specifically in the oil analysis leads you to believe no fuel in your oil? Both are petroleum products. Do you know if they burn the deposits away, measuring what is left behind? Do the fuel deposits get burned away in the process?

Have you simply popped your dipstick and smelled the oil after 1K+ miles, when it's dark? It smell like fuel? When you rub the oil between your fingers, how does the viscosity compare to when new?

I curious if you've done a leakdown test on your motor, what were the results (motor being cold)?

[TypeG]

i've been thinking of trying German Castrol 0 w30 full synthetic. it has zinc in it. you can only get it at AutoZone i'm told. it says made in Germany on the lable. the others made in USA. later.

[HondaFan81]

i've been thinking of trying German Castrol 0 w30 full synthetic. it has zinc in it. you can only get it at AutoZone i'm told. it says made in Germany on the lable. the others made in USA. later.

If you do Brian, post up results on your experience in a separate thread after a good mileage of use. I haven't noticed that oil at a auto parts store, but I'll keep an eye out.

[19dabeast85]

Also, what specifically in the oil analysis leads you to believe no fuel in your oil? Both are petroleum products. Do you know if they burn the deposits away, measuring what is left behind? Do the fuel deposits get burned away in the process?

Have you simply popped your dipstick and smelled the oil after 1K+ miles, when it's dark? It smell like fuel? When you rub the oil between your fingers, how does the viscosity compare to when new?

I curious if you've done a leakdown test on your motor, what were the results (motor being cold)?

The lab specifically tests for fuel content. I was incorrect in saying it is at 0.0%. I looked at my last report and it says the oil had LESS THAN 0.5% fuel with up to 2.0% being tolerable according to them.

My oil never loses its viscosity but does smell like a lawnmower at times....sorta an oily smell.

I don't have a leakdown kit yet, just a compression test kit. And I admit to driving my car pretty hard at least 35% of the time so blow-by is expected especially with our weak rings but so far the oil only gets contaminated by less than 0.5% fuel in 4,900 miles (last analysis).

[cp[mike]]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/5-Zdd...Q5fAccessories

in case anybody else is interested. they also sell singles and 3packs on ebay.

they are always a good idea to add (i have extras for the coupe) though i wouldnt bother on my DD. i started using it with my Mobil1 but by then i had bigger problems so i cant make a good judgement yet. i plan to continue using it, just not sure which oil to stick with.

[starchland]

I dont think its necessary to add zinc. I think its mostly a feel good mod. Modern engine oils already have a decent additive package to begin with and adding this is basically like saying your second guessing the most important fluid in your car. Unless after 7k UOA says your oil is lacking protection, either add a bottle or switch oils. my 2 cents.

[foamypirate]

I dont think its necessary to add zinc. I think its mostly a feel good mod. Modern engine oils already have a decent additive package to begin with and adding this is basically like saying your second guessing the most important fluid in your car. Unless after 7k UOA says your oil is lacking protection, either add a bottle or switch oils. my 2 cents.

Tell that to the Chevy guys running flat tappet cams...

[19dabeast85]

Tell that to the Chevy guys running flat tappet cams...

Exactly, and anyone with H22 euroR cams or Skunk stg2s know to use a high quality oil with zinc also, as should anyone with an aggressive cam. My F22a6 doesn't NEED the best oil in the world, but I can confidently run longer drain intervals, and I also beat on my engine so I need any extra help to make it last till I can afford to build my spare block.....all good reasons to invest in quality oil and because there's too many BS sponsored "official" oil tests out there I choose to do my own little real-world comparison and draw my own conclusions!

[HondaFan81]

Tell that to the Chevy guys running flat tappet cams...

Not to mention "why does my valvetrain make so much noise" threads or an increase of valve adjustment intervals.

IMO, screw running synthetics for the sake of running them. IMO conventional motor oils due provide what you need, but you need the zinc additive as well (which most synthetics do not have). So either run a synthetic with zinc of add zinc to conventional, these are best choices IMO.

Good find Mike.

[starchland]

they have been phasing out zinc in motor oils since the 80s. From my understanding most of them still have low levels, however the zinc has been replaced with other additives to fill the void.