D.Blundell(creator of PGMFI.org) is being sued by Hondata

[d112crzy]

If this is the wrong section, or if you don't think it's appropriate, please remove it, mods.


I don't want this turning into a 'fuck hondata" thread.

I'm simply doing this because Dave needs help in funding for a lawyer, and finding a lawyer.

I'm not optimistic, but you never know...

A situation has come up in which legal advice is needed. The issues involved revolve around an incident in which a company complained about materials posted on this website and the timeliness and manner they were removed. Intellectual property, internet law, and the role and responsibilities of forum maintainers are at stake. I do not currently have the resources to secure a lawyer(s) or even where to find a qualified one(s), so I'm seeing if anyone that comes by here might be able to help. If you have passed the bar with experience in applicable fields of law and wouldn't mind either a consult or handling the case, please contact me via email immediately. If you can recommend any lawyers who would be familiar with applicable law and able to handle the case, please let me know. I'm not going to procrastinate preparing for the worst.

In the event that funds for legal defense are needed, I'll cross that bridge when we get there. I would like to try to resolve things in the most peaceful manner possible. Hopefully, a reasonable agreement can be reached where all parties are satisfied without litigation.

If you believe in god, pray for peace. Otherwise, cross your fingers. This place might may or may not survive a war.

Thanks in advance,
-Dave

Someone posted a k-pro downloader on the pgmfi forum.
I didn't remove it as quickly as Hondata desired due to exams and being busy as hell.
Cease and desists, letters back and forth, demands and counterdemands, etc. (I'll post all the correspondence exchanged previously later.)
And yesterday (10/23/07) I get a proper lawsuit on my back step. Not quite proper service, but I get the point.

You can read more at
http://forum.pgmfi.org/viewtopic.php?t=11755

I already donated. If you wish to donate, send money via paypal to pgmfi@pgmfi.org. Specify what it's for.

I urge, please do NOT make this into a "fuck Hondata" thread. I couldn't agree more with that statement, but keep it civil.

[92cb7accord]

wow thats a bunch of BS, sucks to hear about that, when I get paid on friday (not today) im def gonna donate a little money to the guy.

[ChIoVnIdCa]

I didn't remove it as quickly as Hondata desired due to exams and being busy as hell.

cease and desists, letters back and forth, demands and counterdemands, etc

contradiction... But hope it all works out... sucks when a company goes after the "little guy"

[deevergote]

I stress again the importance of NOT posting copyrighted material, or where to get copyrighted material, on this site! This hits a bit closer to home!

I'm getting paid next week. I'll be sure to send a bit his way. I have yet to start my ECU tuning education, and I hope pgmfi.org will remain in existence when I finally get started!




I'm curious as to what the timeframe was for the demands... How long did Dave have to remove the offending material? I don't know enough to say who is right and who is wrong... well, Dave was wrong for allowing the copyrighted material to be available on his site... but still. If the timeframe was excessively brief, that sucks.

[verothacamaro]

ugh....fuck Hondata.

I hope they go bankrupt. what a silly suit.

*edit*

that's really sad.......of course, open source is always attacked.

[wed3k]

contradiction... But hope it all works out... sucks when a company goes after the "little guy"

especially if it wasnt him that posted it but someone on the board.

fuck that sueing shit.

[d112crzy]

He DOESN'T allow it, at all. He is totally against posting any of that, and has it in the rules.

Someone else posted it. Hondata found out, told him to take it off, and I guess he didn't take it off soon enough for them. Whatever his reasons for not taking it off immediately, I don't know.

He has good ethics. He discourages everyone from reverse engineering Hondata's code. He would never allow such a thing.

If you guys read through the thread, a few people have some good points on how he could win this and even countersue.

[deevergote]

Well, the bottom line is that it was posted on HIS forum. That means HE is responsible. They asked him to remove it, and he didn't in a timely fashion. They have every right to protect their intellectual property. That's business. That's the law.


Not that I like it. I wish Dave the best, and I do truly believe what you say, Jose. I'm sure he's a good guy with good ethics. I'm sure he was just overwhelmed with life, and didn't act fast enough.

I've been to the site. It's not a do it quick, hackjob type tuning site. It's very technical, and the people on there are genuinely intelligent. It's a "be smart on your own, don't steal someone else's smarts" type of thing.

Regardless, whether or not he posted the information himself, he is responsible because it is his site. Just as I would be responsible (and have been held responsible in the past for members' actions)




Honestly, though... the chances that someone would download the Hondata stuff, like it, and eventually buy it... instead of never experiencing OR buying it... are pretty good. The illegal distribution of their stuff probably helped them more than it hurt them.

[deevergote]

ugh....fuck Hondata.

I hope they go bankrupt. what a silly suit.

*edit*

that's really sad.......of course, open source is always attacked.

What did Hondata do wrong here?


Their software was NOT open source... that's the issue.

[civic_90_08]

damn that sucks...IF i had a job, i would send him some.

But funds are tight as hell around my house right now...


-Jordan

[d112crzy]

I'm wondering if they posted a direct link to Hondata's website for the k-pro software.

If that's the case, Hondata is retarded.

the software is on their website to download for free. I should know, I have it.

They're also suing because bad stuff was said about them on pgmfi.org.

Bitches please. Freedom of speach, fuckers.

[verothacamaro]

What did Hondata do wrong here?


Their software was NOT open source... that's the issue.

well thats my point....PGMFI is an open source forums....

[wed3k]

this wasnt supposed to be a flame fest towards hondata you retards.

[cp[mike]]

Oh well Fuck it.

joserdude pleased asked that you keep this flame free. hes just passing us the word, daves provided us so much opportunity with helping develop homebrew tuning and now hes in trouble and needs help.

it sucks that this is what it came down to, but it seems like this is the ultimate result of anything open source and free, the big guy going after the little guy

[owequitit]

It really isn't surprising. Right or wrong, the strategy makes sense. In all honesty, I would suspect Hondata has been waiting for an opportunity. After all, who do you suppose their biggest single threat is? PGMFI.ORG makes it possible for any Joe Schmoe to chip and tune an ECU to run practically any Honda in one capacity or another, and it hurts their bottom line. Why pay Hondata's prices when you can do it yourself for cheaper with a little guidance and knowhow. Really, the only exclusive market they have anymore are the new ECU's that require a new crack every year. But I would be willing to bet that with the way the tuner numbers work out, it would be much more beneficial to them to be selling OBD-I stuff.

Now, in Hondata's defense, it is copyrighted material, or is at least intellectual property, and even when life gets in the way, it was Dave's responsibility to remove it. I don't understand the excuse, because truly I am sure it could have been rectified in a matter of minutes. He could have done it while taking a crap or during a study break. I would like to see the correspondence because I would be willing to be there is more to it. Didn't read the whole thread, so if it is there, I didn't see it.