B16c5????

[HaulAss247]

Heres part of one of my emails with jeff. hes a real good guy, and I trust his advice.
The H motors have serious oiling issues, and balance problems with big
power. You can look at the Honda helms manual to prove it. The #5
journal
asks for like say .0011 clearance, and the #1 journal wants say .0016.
That's not a good sign when Honda is already admitting through the helms
that the block has oiling problems, and to make up for them, you have to
progressively clearance the motor from 1-5. Its also got 2 balance
shafts
because its not really well balanced. It "can't be really well balanced
with 1 journal is a lot tighter than others, the loose end is going to
have
more vibration. So they put the 2 balance shafts in to "help" it.

Never run the motor without the balance shafts or stock, heavy crank
pulley
that is dampened.

Then there is the tensioned issue. H23 tensioned should be20used only on
every H motor.

Then the piston to valve clearance is an issue on Preludes as well.

There is no other Honda motor in the last 15 years that has as many
problems
as the H. It's the worst. When you put a lot of power to them, it
makes
all the problems more severe, and chances of failure compared to other
motors increase dramatically.

Then you add to it the fact it's a LOT more labor to work on a Prelude
than
it is K or B series, you get a full picture of the situation.

I am a Prelude expert, I can tell you all about anything on the motor,
in
detail. How and why and everything.

270 WHP can be had on a Jackson Blower at modest PSI. If I were you, I
would do the Jackson kit, THEN modify it to fit an aftercooler, which I
can
sell you the cooler and radiator setup for it. A little work, and you
can
do 10 PSI on it, no problem and possible make 300.

Believe me when I tell you, 250-300 WHP on a H motor is quite an
accomplishment keeping it as reliable as possible, which is what the
build I
layed out for you will do the best humanly possible.

I know what your saying, and I understand it completely. The thing is,
I
will not sell you, or recommend any customer ANYTHING I would not do
myself.
That's why you come to me, you get no bullshit just to make money. I am
just like you, I want to spend money on something that is power
ful, yet
last
a long time. Notice 300+ WHP Preludes on the internet is so rare? And
if
you see one, its not running the next month and you never hear about it
again? Notice that?

Jeff
BluePrint Racing
Phone:626.575.8866
fax: 626.575.6003
BluePrintRacing.com

[visualpoet]

Ok, that addresses oiling issues with the H series, but says nothing about the F series. Everything I've learned about the F says it's a damn good engine. And just because he says he's an expert doesn't make him one. He says 250-300 hp on a reliable H is "quite an accomplishment", but it's not, really. especially considering the H is available with over 200 hp stock. Maybe he's just had bad luck with his builds? I notice he seems to be pushing the Jackson SC at you. I think you could go turbo for less money, just as (if not more) reliably.

When we're talking about having a smaller with a high power band its talking about racing of course, not everyday driving.

Its thier lack of torque which makes them great for the street and what you end up having for a power to weight ratio. Because the motor makes its power up top and makes low torque its optimal for the street.

A little contradiction there. You originally said for the street, that's why I asked about the street.

And torque comparison between the f22 and b18 is about the same as well. The design of the b18 and b16 motor is better as well.

what? the b18 has 10 ft. lbs less than the f22a1, a noticable difference in torque. And I think a lot of people will disagree that the B is a better design than the F.

[Tnwagn]

Your "guy" says that H22's have oil problems with serious power levels.

Guess what, so does any engine when you push it beyond it's limits.

Also, people have been removing the balance shafts for years on the H22 and it's rarely been known to cause issues. Sure, some of these motors did meet short ends but I would be willing to bet it was due to other circumstances.

And saying that the H22 is Honda's worst motor ever is kind of ludacris. Why is it any worse than the F22, H23, F20, ect?

[Tnwagn]

what? the b18 has 10 ft. lbs less than the f22a1, a noticable difference in torque. And I think a lot of people will disagree that the B is a better design than the F.

The B and F series are both great engines. Their designs are both great for what they've been meant to do. I.E. a B-series wasn't designed to push a heavy ass Accord down the road at all. It was built to be a peppy, high RPM, small displacement motor for small, light Civics and Integras. Also, the F-series was more of a "big block" for Honda at it's creation. It was meant to pull the larger Accord from a standstill, not be a high RPM monster.

[visualpoet]

The B and F series are both great engines. Their designs are both great for what they've been meant to do. I.E. a B-series wasn't designed to push a heavy ass Accord down the road at all. It was built to be a peppy, high RPM, small displacement motor for small, light Civics and Integras. Also, the F-series was more of a "big block" for Honda at it's creation. It was meant to pull the larger Accord from a standstill, not be a high RPM monster.

I'm not saying the B sucks. Just that it's not a better design. It's great in a lightweght car, but I see more Fs into Civics than I see Bs into Accords, because the B doesn't have the low end power.

[Tnwagn]

I'm not saying the B sucks. Just that it's not a better design. It's great in a lightweght car, but I see more Fs into Civics than I see Bs into Accords, because the B doesn't have the low end power.

You are confusing design and power.

You are more likely to see a Corvette engine in a Civic than a Civic engine in a Corvette. It has nothing to do with which has a better design, but rather, which has more power. People don't put F-series engines into their Civics because it's a better design but because it allows them to get more power.

[Accord R33]

reasons not to: torque, wiring, mounts.

reasons to: it would be cool, dunno if its been done before (probly, but not often), its cheap as hell.

reasons you should change the title of this thread: it says b16c5

i vote: do it!

Has the same amount of torque as a F22

The rest of the reasons are valid though. it really just isn't worth it. You'd be better off selling it for profit and buying an h22

[visualpoet]

You are confusing design and power.

You are more likely to see a Corvette engine in a Civic than a Civic engine in a Corvette. It has nothing to do with which has a better design, but rather, which has more power. People don't put F-series engines into their Civics because it's a better design but because it allows them to get more power.

No I'm not confusing the two. I'm just saying (poorly apparently) that neither engine is designed better, just differently. I could have left out the swap reference for clarity.

[JoshM]

You'd be better off selling it for profit and buying an h22

Which is what he did.
Made a $4000 profit.

[Tnwagn]

No I'm not confusing the two. I'm just saying (poorly apparently) that neither engine is designed better, just differently. I could have left out the swap reference for clarity.

Ok, for a minute I thought you were saying than one was, design-wise, better than the other. They are both great engines (Honda, duh), just they were built for different purposes.

Moral of the story: Putting a B-series into a CB is a waste of time, money, and effort when there are much quicker, cheaper, and easier ways to add some power.

I guess it's ok if you want to be 'original', but I'd rather save up and do something a little more practical.

[Accord R33]

Which is what he did.
Made a $4000 profit.

didn't look to see how old this thread was

[PR CB7]

this has been covered so many times it just gets boring after a while
b16c5= CTR motor

1. buy a civic stick it in there, save up some money after it gets stolen
2. sell it and make a profit, a very big profit

if u have an accord and have plans of putting that B in it

save up that money and buy something nice to ur wife or girl, and do some maintenece on ur car

its funny how i know a lot of people with fast b series, and come to accords and preludes they be like lil kids

but seriously bro save up money and then decide what to do

[HaulAss247]

Ok, that addresses oiling issues with the H series, but says nothing about the F series. Everything I've learned about the F says it's a damn good engine. And just because he says he's an expert doesn't make him one. He says 250-300 hp on a reliable H is "quite an accomplishment", but it's not, really. especially considering the H is available with over 200 hp stock. Maybe he's just had bad luck with his builds? I notice he seems to be pushing the Jackson SC at you. I think you could go turbo for less money, just as (if not more) reliably.





A little contradiction there. You originally said for the street, that's why I asked about the street.




what? the b18 has 10 ft. lbs less than the f22a1, a noticable difference in torque. And I think a lot of people will disagree that the B is a better design than the F.

Calm down buddy, so worked up over nothing, nobody is calling the h or f series junk and if they do so what, drive and build what you want. You asked what the oiling issue was, and I told you, I personally haven't looked at the helms manual for th F but my guess and past experience, its probably not far off from the h22. Ever changed the timing belt on your f22? Notice it has balance shafts too? And yea again I said for the street, 95% of the people on here drive thier cars on the street, and race speed etc on the street, Thats the whole idea of the smaller displacement motor being "better" for the street. 10 ft. lbs being noticeable??? Do you really think that our motors having 150,000 miles plus on them and being beat on are still making what was originally stated from the factory? 250-300hp is at the WHEELS. That 200hp stock is rated at the crank not at the wheels. And he didn't say it was hard to do, he said 250-300whp RELIABLY. Meaning, you could drive that car to and from work everyday without issues.

[HaulAss247]

Your "guy" says that H22's have oil problems with serious power levels.

Guess what, so does any engine when you push it beyond it's limits.

Also, people have been removing the balance shafts for years on the H22 and it's rarely been known to cause issues. Sure, some of these motors did meet short ends but I would be willing to bet it was due to other circumstances.

And saying that the H22 is Honda's worst motor ever is kind of ludacris. Why is it any worse than the F22, H23, F20, ect?

The oiling issue wasn't at high power levels, he said its at even higher risk with serious power levels. But the problem can be seen in the oil clearance for the mains stated in the helms manual(stock form). Those clearances are hondas specs from the factory of course

[visualpoet]

Calm down buddy, so worked up over nothing, nobody is calling the h or f series junk and if they do so what, drive and build what you want. You asked what the oiling issue was, and I told you, I personally haven't looked at the helms manual for th F but my guess and past experience, its probably not far off from the h22. Ever changed the timing belt on your f22? Notice it has balance shafts too? And yea again I said for the street, 95% of the people on here drive thier cars on the street, and race speed etc on the street, Thats the whole idea of the smaller displacement motor being "better" for the street. 10 ft. lbs being noticeable??? Do you really think that our motors having 150,000 miles plus on them and being beat on are still making what was originally stated from the factory? 250-300hp is at the WHEELS. That 200hp stock is rated at the crank not at the wheels. And he didn't say it was hard to do, he said 250-300whp RELIABLY. Meaning, you could drive that car to and from work everyday without issues.

I'm not worked up, just discussing. And yes, the F has a balance shaft, and there is a balance shaft delete kit sold for it, and there are dozens of people on here alone that have removed the balance shaft belt on their F and H series and have no problems at all. I understand that most of the motors out there have been abused, beaten, worked hard, and put out less hp than they did from the factory. never questioned that for a minute. I'm just saying that a well built H series should be able to put out 250-300 whp and still be reliable. It seems to me that you're basing your opinion on the things this one guy has said to you. I'm not saying he's completely wrong, I'm just offering that maybe he's not completely right, either.