F20B vs. H22A

[Hondacide91]

What are the main differences from F20B and an H22A? I think the F20B came from an Euro Accord, but antway which one is better and are they close at all?

[h22sparkle]

well for starters they have the same amount of hp the compression ratio's are different the f20b c/r is 11.0 and the h22 is 10:1 usdm and the j-spec is 10:6:1 . In the end the f20b has less torque and its better off just gettin a base model
now compare that to
http://www.hmotorsonline.com/shop/sc...age&item=30012

this
http://www.hmotorsonline.com/shop/sc...age&item=30015

vary the price and you tell me which one you rather spend your money on.

[rickyduckworth]

the automatic f20b only had 180hp due to a smaller tb, less aggressive cams and tuning aimed more to getting low end torque than high rpm hp......people will sell these as the 200hp version coupled with an lsd h22a tranny sometimes....

it had electric power steering so you'll have to make your hydraulic setup work

it's obd2

it was mainly designed because honda needed 500 of these motors in their cars so that they could compete in a certain racing class......had to be 2 liters or less and had to be motor offered to the public.....so they made this, more than a destroked h22a, but along those lines.....less torque, peakier powerband, more advanced but overall when considering cost, the cheaper, more powerful h22a is better.....the h22a is a very good motor

[Joey GT-R]

Hi I'm new here but I'm from HSO, if any of you know about that but anyway I was considering this as well. I am purchasing an engine as soon as school let's out in June/July and I'm leaning towards the F20B because it has lower compression and can be boosted without rebuilding the engine like you have to for the H22A. I believe the H22A has to be sleeved, and given better bearings, along with some other small stuff. Plus I hear that if done it's not even streetable.

BTW, h22sparkle where are you located? I'm planning on doing this swap myself and having a little experience around would be invaluable. Plus I doubt what you charge is $1000 like a shop.

[gloryaccordy]

It's really in the air. The F20B has higher compression...but if you get one you can just swap pistons/rods with your stock F. I'm pretty sure that would drop compression to boostable levels. The H has 150cc more displacement though. If you're serious about boosting it, I think the F20B would be the better way to go...

[gloryaccordy]

THe F20B can't really be compared to any regular H22A...if you must compare... do it with the H22A4...

beefier 55mm mains...

The head casting is alot better than any run of the mill production motor I've seen... The 88mm stroke allows you to rev higher without fear of breakage... It does trade off some low end for it though... but it defintely is a better factory motor than any OBDI H22A...

They should have less miles than most OBDI h22a's also considering they are newer...

They are much more common now and not as rare as they used to be... so the costs aren't even as high as they used to be...

This areguement of F20B vs. H22a is really old... but it seems to me the H22a side is still saying the same old things when they just arent as true...

I would garuntee that no one in this thread has had any actual experience with the F20B... or if they have it is anecdotal at best... There is a guy named machine on Hondasociety and Honda-Tech that has had both... he is the one to ask... All I will say about his opinion is that he likes the F20B better...

Yeh...If people rock with F20As there's no reason not to rock with an F20B. The only thing I'd worry about really is the torque issue...but if you're boosting that's a non-issue. But honestly now that I look at it, the F20B is the best of all worlds...iron sleeves, DOHC VTEC head, short stroke, 85mm pistons...you really can't go wrong. You can bore the block out for H22 pistons as well, and get that extra displacement back too. Man, the possibilities are endless...

[rickyduckworth]

THe F20B can't really be compared to any regular H22A...if you must compare... do it with the H22A4...

beefier 55mm mains...

there you have it, the larger the mains the better the motor, discussion over lol

The head casting is alot better than any run of the mill production motor I've seen

they have just as much casting flash as your "run of the mill" h22a......i actually cut my finger on some of it while reaching into the ports because i specifically wanted to see if it was remotely as massaged over as the b18c5....and it's not.....the only f or h series that is in the ITR neighborhood is the h22a from the type s and the h22a7.....the f20c/f20b/h22a/h22a1/h22a4 are all about the same when it comes to "factory headwork"....it's minimal....this motor wasn't meant to impress, it was meant to be adequate and different, but mainly there so honda could race in that 2 liter and under BTCC class........

... The 88mm stroke allows you to rev higher without fear of breakage... It does trade off some low end for it though... but it defintely is a better factory motor than any OBDI H22A...

so the h22a is held back by it's inability to rev past 8000rpm? where do most cams quit making power? exactly

They should have less miles than most OBDI h22a's also considering they are newer...

so you can't use h22a4's now? didn't know that......just like buying any jdm engine, unless you see the car's odometer it came out of, you can assume you're being lied to........the fact that the motor is available means the car isn't sitting in a garage somewhere receiving minimal wear and tear......it means the car the motor came in is no longer on the road.....most evidence suggests that the average sport compact there gets it's fair share of abuse regardless of mileage.......they aren't usually worried about hurting the engine, just getting what they can out of it then getting rid of the car......not very comforting, but a good motor is a good motor.......just no reason to believe the mileage will be lower because it has an f20b stamp

They are much more common now and not as rare as they used to be... so the costs aren't even as high as they used to be...

compared to your average 200hp h22a, they're high.......the price is what it is because of the fact that it is rare compared to the h22a......there were fewer of them.....and you just contradicted yourself because if there are more of them around to buy, then that means the chassis they once resided in are probably scrap........again, doesn't say to me that the motor is fine and dandy

This areguement of F20B vs. H22a is really old... but it seems to me the H22a side is still saying the same old things when they just arent as true...

well, the motor sure haven't evolved so yeah, the same things are gonna be said.....

truths:

1) the h22a costs less
2) the h22a has as much peak hp, and a more powerful powerband everywhere else
3) the h22a has one of the best flowing heads honda has ever produced, and when cleaned up (not ported and polished, just removal of casting flash) will flow well enough to make 300whp via turbo/na/etc.....the heads were WAY ahead of their time
4) the f20b doesn't use frm sleeves, but that just means that boring it out is a huge risk, so if you want a larger bore, you'll have to resleeve....without boost, get used to f20c-ish torque.......and how much extra was spent to get how much less power?

I would garuntee that no one in this thread has had any actual experience with the F20B... or if they have it is anecdotal at best... There is a guy named machine on Hondasociety and Honda-Tech that has had both... he is the one to ask... All I will say about his opinion is that he likes the F20B better...

i didnt' cut my finger on my imagination....how many have you been through? i've seen it inside and out and although it's not just an "h22a", it's not worth paying extra for.......and i've still not seen a way to identify the auto f20b's from the manual ones........without a side by side comparison, you're guessing because i've personally never read about a stamp you can go by or anything........

the f20b is cool, but if you are going to compare it to an h22a, then you have to factor in price.......just like the type s vs. h22a thing....sure, the type s has tons of real differences, and i'd love to have one, but the value of power/dollar isn't as good as what it is on the h22a, and since these motors aren't free, it's a big part of the equation........


there is no reason to say either is better or worse for turbo, cr can be changed easy enough on both.......no reason to say the f20b is better for all motor because it gives up .2 liters of displacement even though you don't have to sleeve it to use higher cr pistons......revving means shit because v8's have been making power for years revving to a measley 5500rpm......all that matters is power.......the h22a is better for overall power since it's bigger.....if the f20b had received the treatment the b18c5 did, and put out 220hp, then it would be different

the h22a type s uses different metal compounds, different valve seat angles, different everything.......it was well thought out and was meant to showcase certain aspects of honda's capabilities....

the f20b was meant to be 2 liters and work, plain and simple

you're paying extra for less power and no more potential......oh, and that blue valve cover........

to me, it's not worth it because i can't afford to waste money.......i'd love to have an h22a type s one day, but until wasting $2000 more on it is feasible, i will not have it

[gloryaccordy]

But we can all agree that for boost, the F20B>>>>the H22A as you can go with custom 85mm pistons or just the 8.8:1 (I dunno what it would be in the F20B) pistons from the stock F, yes? Isn't that what this was all about?

[rickyduckworth]

But we can all agree that for boost, the F20B>>>>the H22A as you can go with custom 85mm pistons or just the 8.8:1 (I dunno what it would be in the F20B) pistons from the stock F, yes? Isn't that what this was all about?

the f20b gets 200hp with compression and high revving.....get rid of that cr and slap a turbo on and you're taking one step back and 2 forward.......

the h22a's sleeve aren't the reason you can't boost them to 15psi stock, it's the pistons ring lands.......there were 2 people on SHO that had 10psi boosted ludes a few years back.......nothing internal done......one dude made it well over 100,000 miles on 93 octane in his 10:1 CR h22a1 at 10psi.......that's over 250whp if you do a few more things too......running 12's reliably isn't bad

the f20b was made for n/a..........i'm sure you could take one, slap a turbo on and tune it and make nice numbers, but i don't think the h22a would put up those same numbers and be more fragile.....and again, you've spent less on the h22a.....

to me, cost is the most important thing......some people just like to rev......some like to be different.....some don't

[gloryaccordy]

So like the rest of the F-related motors the problems with the H are just the ringlands? I thought for some reason the sleeves were more delicate and boost was limited to like 6psi...fuck it...if it can take the regular well tuned 15psi then I see your point more. I just get antsy when you put "boost" and "10:1 compression" in the same sentence.

[OnE eYe GuY]

it was mainly designed because honda needed 500 of these motors in their cars so that they could compete in a certain racing class......had to be 2 liters or less and had to be motor offered to the public

same with the s2000 before they converted to a 2.2 liter.
sorry