F22a6 intake swap

[mrhonda]

Re: Re: F22a6 intake swap

Originally posted by midnite racer x
You don't need an a6 ecu...you only need it if u want to have the butterflies closed before 4700 rpm. If u don't have it then they will just stay open all the time like mine.

Well, the only problem with having the butterflies open all the time is you lose alot of low-end torque. That's why the butterflies are there in the first place. Long skinny runners build low-end torque, however at higher RPM large short runners are needed to build top-end power. So with the butterfly valve, you get the best of both worlds. Having the butterfly valve open at low RPM, you're intake charge doesn't have the velocity necessary to build low-end torque. Does that make any sense? That's the best way I can think to explain it.

[XLR Azn]

Originally posted by mrhonda
BTW, I just remembered, fuel pressure on A6 cars is 40psi, vs 36 psi on A1 and A4 cars. So it might not be a bad idea to trow in an EX fuel pump so it doesn't lean out at higher RPM when the butterflies open.

would a S-AFC help control that? even on an A1 ECU?
juss wondering

[MRX]

s-afc would add more fuel or less fuel depending on what u tell it to do...u could just get a fuel pressure regulator and turn it up if it scares u so. They're like $80-$180. But there is nothing wrong with my a1 engine with the a6 mani...nor would i change anything if i was staying N/A

[speedyhonda]

butterflies open or not ?

whats really the purpose of gettting these open or close ? will u get more power if they open at high rpm or will u lose ? and is it a good idea to manually open and close the BF with a switch ? when would u know to open or close them ? im just curious and new to all this. :P so bare with me.

[SoySauceCb7]

ok boss its really nice not having to switch open the valve everytime you drive and getting a a6 ecu is not hard at all i got my manifold two days ago and now my ecu is being shipped its really not a hassle. The one thing that i need to find is the solenoid. right now there is a diaphram so wondering how that works

[SoySauceCb7]

What butterfly soleinoid are you talking about on mine there is only a vavum line that connects to a diaphram that leads to the valve that closes because it has a spring that shuts it when there is no vacum.

[HondaFan81]

Originally posted by mrhonda
BTW, I just remembered, fuel pressure on A6 cars is 40psi, vs 36 psi on A1 and A4 cars. So it might not be a bad idea to trow in an EX fuel pump so it doesn't lean out at higher RPM when the butterflies open.

In looking up part #'s some random day, i believe that fuel pumps in cb7's are all the same, it's in the fuel pressure regulator that f22a1/a4 vs f22a6 vary. It's what I found out.....take what u want from it.

[HondaFan81]

Re: Re: Re: F22a6 intake swap

Originally posted by mrhonda
Well, the only problem with having the butterflies open all the time is you lose alot of low-end torque. That's why the butterflies are there in the first place. Long skinny runners build low-end torque, however at higher RPM large short runners are needed to build top-end power. So with the butterfly valve, you get the best of both worlds. Having the butterfly valve open at low RPM, you're intake charge doesn't have the velocity necessary to build low-end torque. Does that make any sense? That's the best way I can think to explain it.

And that's why Honda has the F22a6 ECU in control of this IAB system. If you want some improvement in performance just do it like that, if you actually know where you want the low-end vs high end transition and have background knowledge in this, then do what ya want....you can rig it up however. Don't try and outdo something that''s been already done, when you have no idea what you are doing.

[Clemson90Accord]

How much of a hp/tq gain do you guys think this mod adds? Is it really worth it. I was thinking that it might be better to get an aftermarket IM instead. What do you guys think?

[urbanrunner]

more then lil,ely if u have an ex u already got the dual runners, so it won;t help much, but if u have a a1 or a4 engine the dual runners could really help your performance matcht the ex's stock hp, but if you put an h23 top end of the a6 bottom end then you go tmore air coming in, i think the a6 tb is like 54mm, and the h23 tb is like 64 or 68 mm.....more air is good on an all motor setup

[MRX]

Originally posted by urbanrunner
more then lil,ely if u have an ex u already got the dual runners, so it won;t help much, but if u have a a1 or a4 engine the dual runners could really help your performance matcht the ex's stock hp, but if you put an h23 top end of the a6 bottom end then you go tmore air coming in, i think the a6 tb is like 54mm, and the h23 tb is like 64 or 68 mm.....more air is good on an all motor setup

your almost there young one...just look on your block for the engine code stamp next to the rubber piece that covers the flywheel's hole. I do think your tb sizes are a bit off but not by much. I believe the prelude tb is more like 60mm or so. Its not that more air is good its the velocity of the air coming in combined with the amount of air that can be supplied. The dual runners supply more with losing too much of the velocity to stuff the cylinders full of air. It's good for any motor setup be it all motor, forced induction, etc. Some others will state that using the single runner manifold with a port and polish or extrude hone is better but that kind of thing is usually done on smaller motors. The power gains are decent, and for the $100 i spent on the IM, it was a much more noticeable and overall superior gain of power to this $170+ intake i bought I wish i could start over sometimes lol...with the things i know now...man lol

[MRX]

Originally posted by Clemson90Accord
How much of a hp/tq gain do you guys think this mod adds? Is it really worth it. I was thinking that it might be better to get an aftermarket IM instead. What do you guys think?

8-10 ft/lbs. of torque and probably 7-9 hp from 4800rpm on up...and if you can find an aftermarket IM for this motor then you must have made it yourself lol. Because as far as i know not a one exists

[Fearit22]

Well from what I understand you really don't gain that much throughout the whole power band... You're right you get more hp in the top end when the dual runners open up, and you gain torque in the low end from them being closed. If you don't get an ecu for it they will be open all the time and you lose low end power. I'm not going to waste the money on it though.... I talked to a guy that will port and polish my intake manifold for $70 so I'm sure I'll get way more power out of that than an ex manifold. Considering the price of the manifold and ecu it will come out cheaper that way too.

[MRX]

Originally posted by Fearit22
Well from what I understand you really don't gain that much throughout the whole power band... You're right you get more hp in the top end when the dual runners open up, and you gain torque in the low end from them being closed. If you don't get an ecu for it they will be open all the time and you lose low end power. I'm not going to waste the money on it though.... I talked to a guy that will port and polish my intake manifold for $70 so I'm sure I'll get way more power out of that than an ex manifold. Considering the price of the manifold and ecu it will come out cheaper that way too.

see...to each his own boys and girls And yes the noticeable power comes at about 4800rpm or so. Sure there are some pros and cons on both sides. Forinstance if you p&p the single runner IM you have to buy another manifold or wait a couple of days to a week or 2 to have the car up and running again. This is gonna become like the turbo f22 or the h22 debate lol

[Fearit22]

I have my own reasons for doing it. I'm going to end up running a Hondata and the ecu I'll have to get wouldn't be able to make the dual runners function. Port and polish is cheaper too so... I think I would probably get a lot more power from it than the dual runner intake especially if I get my throttle body ported and polished too.