F/H specs... The official H/F piston/rod/crank/block specs

[ZigenBallZ]

its a new playing field..

That's my only point...

Those holding onto the old fashioned ways of thinking and "expertise" can sit back and say your crazy idea aint never gonna work... and what's it to them...? If they are right they get to say I told you so... if not then they learn something and then add that info to their cahce of expert info they can spout ad nauseum in that oh so familiar condescending way...

The risk takers are the ones doing things that people said weren't possible... finding weak points, addressing them and innovating new methods along with new information...

I find the after the fact anecdote about someone else's setup and you saying you were right all along a bit sad and a reaching attempt to justify your side of the arguement...

Engine dynamics is engine dynamincs is blah blah blah...

end arguement... you have your opinion and everyone else has theres... we can all entertain opposing viewpoints without being condescending about it...Why not encourage new things and help find solutions to problem areas instead of just saying It aint gonna work and i toldja so....

Seems fairly negative to me...

[Rick Solis]

I do encourage new things, I just dont encourage bad ideas...

You can run the F23 crank and make it work quite well in a NA motor... It just needs a lot of work and you wont be running the stock rods...

You can run a F block and make it work, it just wont work as well with a smaller bore than the diameter of the combustion chamber...

Big strokes and turbo just plain and simply dont work... period... Not much more to say about that...

Im not what youd consider an old school thinker, I myself think WAAAY the fuck outside the box... I just know enough to think with in reason...

[MRX]

Big strokes and turbo just plain and simply dont work... period... Not much more to say about that...

Little more in depth please...simply saying it doesn't work and trying to use the PRO's as an example still doesn't tell us why.

[ZigenBallZ]

Im not what youd consider an old school thinker, I myself think WAAAY the fuck outside the box... I just know enough to think with in reason...

No offense intended... but no one thinks they are constrianed by the infamous "box"...even those who clearly are...

I mean I'm destroking a SOHC F to an 88mm crank along with a 1-2mm increase in bore size which to my knowledge has not been widely discussed on the internet...at least not in much more than theory...

on other motors yes...but the world of F's is still a fairly gaping wide open space even with new information being learned everyday... and those that I have talked to about it have had amazing firsthand results...

You don't see me touting bisi's results now you? I am going to have to compile my own data and come to my own conclusions and compare my results to the differeing factors in similar setups...

but once again the lack of actual experience is limited... and I am bombarded with discussions of how the principles affect other motors with different dynamics... The principles need to be adjusted on an individual basis...accepted information on engine dynamics only gets you so far... without real world results...

To each their own I guess... I guess some are more caught up in pure theory and take fewer risks and others are willing to charge headlong into what has been said can't be done... or is not worth it...

and still others take accepted principles into acct and take calculated risks just to measure the result... to get a more solid understanding of what works and more specifically WHY and what can be done to improve upon it...

[Rick Solis]

Little more in depth please...simply saying it doesn't work and trying to use the PRO's as an example still doesn't tell us why.

ive explained it so many times it gets tiresome after a while... but one more time just for shits and giggles...

When you increase stroke and shorten rod length you are doing a few things. 1 you are increasing cylinder pressure which isnt something you want to do witha motor that will be boosting. And 2 you are shortening the amount of time the piston stays, or, dwells at top dead center. With the larger 95-97 strokes and the short 5.551-5.572 rods the ppiston is in short, running away from the flame. With the amount of air and fuel a turbo motor compresses and ignites you want the piston to stay at TDC for as long as possible. Thats not really possible with a large stroke. You have to back off of timing a bit and run your tune a little more conservative... Not too great for power output...

Also, with a turbo creating all the power/torque you could need/want... Why would you opt to sacrifice efficiency for an effort to create a few additional ft lbs of torque? I guess the 250-500 ft lbs of torque a turbo can produce isnt enough, gotta have that extra few at any cost... Even if it means sacrificing efficiency and overall power output potential...

[WiKKeDV16]

i love this fucking thread.....

[Dutchaccord]

REPOST

http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...gine+internals

[gloryaccordy]

LOL @ Honda's pseudo-cheap ways and D/B series fanatics, they're green with envy!!!

Displacement is overrated...I'm kinda with Rick on this one, although I have basically no experience with engine building.

All-motor: I'd go with the H22 head on an F22 block with the H22 bottom end guts; you have the best of everything besides the cooling of the block and the oil spray on the pistons. I feel like the oil squirters can be transferred though, and with the little money you'd save on the full swap you could get an oil cooler and a better radiator. Problems solved.

Turbo: I'd go with the A6 head over an H22 crank and F22 pistons/custom rods in an F22 block. With a turbo spec cam this setup would go nicely with an early EVO turbo setup, and the only unreplacable thing is the crank...who breaks those anyway? Get some better bearings, an oil cooler, and a better radiator...you're good to go. Nice 7000-8000RPM turbo motor.

Truthfully, the H22 crank is the way. You get 2.1 liters in the F22 block with F22 pistons, and you get a decent N/A motor with the H22 crank and rods with F22 pistons I'd imagine. You could go even crazier and get 11.0-11.5:1 pistons, and if you're good with gas and tuning you'll have a sick motor, even with stock cams...seriously prob. 130-140WHP depending on the motor and whatever bolt ons you have. Plus you get more room up top to rev safely...

Again, displacement is overrated...I'd go with geometry over displacement any day...but that's just my uneducated opinion also.

[HondaFan81]

If someone is really set on an idea, they will carry it out how they want to. I do not like to discourage anyone on any idea, no matter how crazy it is. The greatest ideas have come from those that broke barriers and the rules of that time. Let people do their thing and if they find out something good, you know they will be bragging about it later. Others can then capitilize on the newly found info.

I do agree though, that some ideas can be carried out and could be cool, but may not be the most reliable/durable set up in the long run. But maybe that person will change their mind and do another project in the future anyways, so to each their own.