Need opinions? Rebuild or Swap?

[Laviathan222]

So the old F22A4 Is getting tired at it's 268K miles... I wont be able to afford this for a few months but would like to have a game plan set in my mind before hand... Now i suppose i should post my expectations with the car first.

I plan on achieving around 200-250HP Nothing crazy, mostly looking for something quick and reliable... If i could reach 200hp n/a i'd be happy, although i'd be happy boosting it, just don't want to be like everyone else in the area and run un-tuned and blow my sh*t up... and boosting/tuning is something i've never personally done before, but i would like to learn.

Now i've done some research, the H22A1 sits at 187HP plus mileage and wear and tear... etc but can be pricey $1000 Approx

The F22B1 Vtec sits at 145HP and considerably cheaper and found locally easier, at $400

buy another F22A4-A6 for approx $275 and 120K miles locally...

Or Rebuild mine and boost/ something i've never done as well, but would like to learn... i've done head swaps in the past, dropped tranny's in parking lot's etc... so i'm pretty comfortable on doing a rebuild... Cost unknown i can't find a genuine honda rebuild kit only ebay ones ranging from $250 to $600

I'd like to set a budget of $1250 into this, may be unrealistic but we'll see with your guys reply's... i'm open to any ideas within 200hp and $1250 if possible at all... I'd like to keep my tranny if possible as well.

[SOHC-FTW]

If you're going N/A throw the F22b1 head away more or less. And if $1000 is pricey i don't see you making 200hp on a F so cheaply.

A B1's a great stock replacement with a bit more power than an A6 stock, but if you're in it for power the b1 topend isn't so good. A true honest to god rebuild done right would be easily $800+ you more than likely will need machine work and don't forget gaskets, the list goes on.

[Laviathan222]

If you're going N/A throw the F22b1 head away more or less. And if $1000 is pricey i don't see you making 200hp on a F so cheaply.

I'm a cheap a$$ what can i say? haha i guess i should say what is the cheapest way to achieve this amount of power without breaching reliability, and what should i expect to pay.

[SOHC-FTW]

An H22 or F20b swap will be reliable with good power, but matted to any USDM f series transmission you will fall out of the power band. It will be slower due to gear ratios and FD, but your transmission will matte up with either swap.

Cheap, reliability, and performance rarely go hand and hand unless you find good deals.

[Laviathan222]

Alternatively i was just reading about the F20B and can be had for about $800 and that sits at just around 200hp in the manual version...

[evil_demon_01]

1st question - What makes you say your engine is "tired"

2nd question - What do YOU want?




Your post says you want 200-250Hp.
Then you go on to suggest 4 options, of which three are less than your expected goal.



If you want 200-250 Hp get an H22 with an IEH and a set of cams with a tune.

[SOHC-FTW]

F20b is OBD2 so a few things are needed such as a intake manifold, wiring up the distributor and a few more bits. Check out the swap section for more info.

[Laviathan222]

An H22 or F20b swap will be reliable with good power, but matted to any USDM f series transmission you will fall out of the power band. It will be slower due to gear ratios and FD, but your transmission will matte up with either swap.

yeah i was just reading about the F20B. i'll be upgrading the tranny once the cash flow comes in. So to achieve this power i'd most likely rule out rebuild and boost as that would cost the man hours, and a significant amount of cash... also then, in case i get power hungry down the road, how do the F20B and H22 hold up for boost (5-7 psi) on stock internals?

[SOHC-FTW]

No sure fire answer, no too engines are exactly alike. If you want reliable power especially when boosting it's going to cost and be knowledgeable about building a engine, and psi is irrelevant really.

If you're on a budget stick with I/H/E and maybe a tune, don't get ahead of yourself.

Like EVIL said what makes you think your current engine is worn out? Have you even performed a compression or leak down test on it yet?

[Laviathan222]

1st question - What makes you say your engine is "tired"

2nd question - What do YOU want?




Your post says you want 200-250Hp.
Then you go on to suggest 4 options, of which three are less than your expected goal.



If you want 200-250 Hp get an H22 with an IEH and a set of cams with a tune.

The 3 options were to include boosting it i was suspecting.

1. i'm not sure i'm just assuming it's tired, it like to burn and leak oil, not too much but enough to have to constantly check the dipstick... and now that i think of it it may have been manual swapped, and the cluster isn't auto so the mileage may not be correct.

2. i don't really have a preferred engine or a want, just like to hear what other people have experienced with the different motors which ones are better then base my decision on what i want then

[Laviathan222]

No sure fire answer, no too engines are exactly alike. If you want reliable power especially when boosting it's going to cost and be knowledgeable about building a engine, and psi is irrelevant really.

If you're on a budget stick with I/H/E and maybe a tune, don't get ahead of yourself.

hahaha! perfect, exactly what i was looking for! Someone to tell me hey, slow down there turbo, you dont need boost yet! lol sounds like a pretty solid setup though with I/H/E

[SOHC-FTW]

You're going to need a much bigger budget if you want to boost and be reliable at the same time. Many have boosted stock engine's and had them last BUT just as many if not more have blown them up in a very short time, it's a gamble. If i were you i'd be doing a load of research on the subject of engine's and FI before you waste your money and wind up with a big paper weight.

[Laviathan222]

You're going to need a much bigger budget if you want to boost and be reliable at the same time. Many have boosted stock engine's and had them last BUT just as many if not more have blown them up in a very short time, it's a gamble. If i were you i'd be doing a load of research on the subject of engine's and FI before you waste your money and wind up with a big paper weight.

yeah i've seen stock boosted civic motors with 130K last 5K on boost and on the contrary i've seen stock civic motors with 310K that had been running boost for almost 100K miles so a gamble it would be, so i guess i'll just go N/A for the time being... i dont need a $2000 paper weight... lol

[evil_demon_01]

1. i'm not sure i'm just assuming it's tired, it like to burn and leak oil, not too much but enough to have to constantly check the dipstick... and now that i think of it it may have been manual swapped, and the cluster isn't auto so the mileage may not be correct.

2. i don't really have a preferred engine or a want, just like to hear what other people have experienced with the different motors which ones are better then base my decision on what i want then

1) Assumptions will not get you an answer or a solution.
If it's leaking oil, fix the leak. Replacing the engine really isn't a solution for a leak.
And as for the manual swap - You sound unsure if what your saying is even true.

If your engine is indeed rubbish, then look at replacing it.



2) EVERYONE is going to have a different opinion.
I know people here that will say -

Boost your current motor as is.
Build your current motor.
Swap an H22.
Swap an H23.
Swap an F22B.
Swap an F23.
Swap an F20.
Swap a K20.
Swap a K24.
Swap a V6.
Mix and match an F and H motor, then magically call it a G.
Boost your Swap
Build your Swap.

ETC . . . .

YOU need to decide what you want and your goal of 200-250 really dictates your options, Along with the fact that you also said - Reliable and cheap.

[SOHC-FTW]

1) Assumptions will not get you an answer or a solution.
If it's leaking oil, fix the leak. Replacing the engine really isn't a solution for a leak.
And as for the manual swap - You sound unsure if what your saying is even true.

If your engine is indeed rubbish, then look at replacing it.



2) EVERYONE is going to have a different opinion.
I know people here that will say -

Boost your current motor as is.
Build your current motor.
Swap an H22.
Swap an H23.
Swap an F22B.
Swap an F23.
Swap an F20.
Swap a K20.
Swap a K24.
Swap a V6.
Mix and match an F and H motor, then magically call it a G.
Boost your Swap
Build your Swap.

ETC . . . .

YOU need to decide what you want and your goal of 200-250 really dictates your options, Along with the fact that you also said - Reliable and cheap.

Could not agree more, very well put.