I have a 100% stock F22A1, and i want to know what type of hp numbers can the stock bottom end hold? im looking to start off for my first setup around 200-250 hp. and are there other F or H series bottom end parts that i can swap over....i searched around but didn't find the info i wanted
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Last edited by Rookdarealest; 05-20-2012, 01:32 PM. -
How hard did you search, really? I have taken part in half a dozen discussions on this topic in the past month alone!
The stock bottom end cannot hold ANY boost for long, without breaking a ringland. It might last a year, it might last a week. It might blow the first time you hit boost.
With a properly sized turbo and a quality tune, you can expect 200-220whp on a stock F22A to be fairly reliable until a ringland breaks. People have gotten as high as 300whp... I think one even made it to 400whp on race gas (the car was a race-only car, carried on a trailer and not driven on the street.)
ALL stock-block turbo setups break eventually. Some are minor, some are catastrophic. If you expect to drive the car daily, and you can't afford a good amount of downtime while you repair or replace a damaged engine, I suggest forgetting turbo. If it is a project car that you can afford to blow up, go for it.
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soon as you responded i seen the other post about this..my badd deevOriginally posted by deevergote View Post
but what about my second question??? what other honda motors can i swap bottom end parts from??? forgive my questions, im a noob tryin become great....Comment
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There are no stock bottom end parts you can use that will withstand boost. If you want to safely boost, you'll need forged internals. A low-boost setup can use inexpensive forged stuff, but even the inexpensive stuff is going to cost a fair amount of money.
Boost done right isn't cheap, sadly. Boost done cheap isn't reliable.
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You will never become great if you can't use the resources at your disposal to their maximum potential....
There are no stock parts you can swap over to make the car more reliable. All Honda motors are Naturally Aspirated save two. One doesn't exist in America and the second I would estimate to cost around $10,000 minimum for all the fabrication and custom parts needed to get it to run. No other engine was designed to hold boost reliably.
My advice to you is if you can't afford to have your car down for a reliable build, you leave boost alone.'94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq
Originally posted by deevergoteComment
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Three, actually... the City Turbo, the Legend, and the RDX. There may even be more that I'm not aware of.
But yes, most Honda engines use cast aluminum pistons. Perfectly fine for N/A applications, but they don't withstand boost for very long.
I HAVE heard that the S2000 can take a beating on a stock block and survive for quite some time. The internals there MIGHT be forged, I'm not sure (and I don't care to research it right now.) Still, that doesn't help in this situation.
All F and H engines, the only ones we're really concerned about, do not have internals that can take boost.
DSM pistons can be used, and it has been done in the past... but with the amount of custom work to make it work (and hopefully be reliable), it's better to just pay a little extra for something that is made to fit.
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Originally posted by deevergote View Post
Crap I forgot about that damned thing, now I'm never going to hear the end of this.....
'94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq
Originally posted by deevergoteComment
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It wouldn't be Sunday if I didn't correct SOMETHING you said!
The important parts are 100% correct, though
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thanks for the info... so what do u guys suggest?? an N/A build.....Comment
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It's your car. You need to figure out what you want for it, then follow through. Don't be wishy-washy, or you'll never accomplish anything at all!
Doing either boost or N/A properly is not going to be cheap.
A boosted engine needs forged internals, or the ringlands will break. Higher boost will need stronger sleeves, and a closed deck (the F22A is open.)
A high revving N/A setup will need higher compression pistons, headwork, an upgraded valvetrain, forged rods to withstand the tensile stress of high revs...
Either will need a proper tune on a dyno for optimal performance and reliability.
To do either the correct way, you should expect to spend at least $8,000... maybe over $10,000.
Honestly, what I would do... plan on $5000.
Get an H22A swap with LSD. Expect everything to there to cost about $2000. Spend $1000 on a GOOD header (SMSP, HyTech, etc... stay away from cheap knockoff brands.) $500 on a good exhaust system. $500 on camshafts. $500 on a chipped P28 ECU, tuned on a dyno. $500 on random maintenance items (seals, gaskets, etc...)
There's your $5000. Gone already. It's EASY to blow through that money! That setup should get you 200-220whp, tops. If you don't abuse it, it should last.
Then focus on your suspension. Get a quality suspension (H&R Cup Kit would be my suggestion... affordable and very high quality), some sway bars, some chassis reinforcement from ESP, and some good wheels and tires. Everything there will easily cost another $2000-$3000.
Assuming your car is worth about $2000 as it is now, that's a $10,000 car. It will accelerate and handle on par with $20,000+ sporty cars on the market today.
Follow that general plan, and don't deviate from it, and you'll have a nice car. Deviate from that plan, and you'll end up throwing money at a car that will never amount to anything much.
(I know from experience...)
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thanks deev u have given me a lot to think about.....still leaning toward boost but u def have given some very useful infoComment
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If you want a good idea of a parts list for a turbo set up look in my thread in the off-topic section. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=190444 I have a list on there and a few others have chimed in with parts I didn't think about. You will end up saving a lot of money if you can do most of the work yourself.Comment
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