f22b2 and delta 272 cam

[boricuacvc]

ok. short story here.

i have a 4th and 5th gen accord. 5th gen got another f22b2 cuz the original was done. in doing so, i did the 5 spd swap. also decided to throw the delta 272 cam regrind with an AEM adjustable cam gear. everything was done in my garage. car turned over and i was happy.

the problem: i cannot get the car to idle. delta camshaft told me to have the camshaft broken in at 2k rpms for about 20 min. i did. but i cannot get the car to stay on under 2k rpms. adjusted the throttle body cable and nothing. it just wont stay on. so i took the car to a shop. they've had the car for 2 months and nothing. they can't figure out wat to do to get it working correctly. im tired of waiting and the car has been "under construction" for about 6 months now.

i was told to get an apexi SAFC to help in tuning. i got one but the shop hasnt installed it and says it wont make a diff. was told to get an adjustable FPR but others say i wont need it. was also told to get a p06 ecu and have it chipped and tuned, but once again, i dont wanna just get stuff if it won't help.

want can i do here? i want the car back and can't seem to pinpoint the issue. shop has checked cam timing, cam install, ignition timing, spark, distributor/cap/rotor, tdc the engine, compression, and im sure other things as well.

please help.

[rexload]

double check timing and valve adjustment, you sure you adjusted the valves correctly? the shop had it for two months? are they retarded? take it to somebody who knows what they are doing or put the stock cam back in and see if you still have the problem. you it should idle just fine on the stock ecu. good luck!

[F22HB]

Yeah, plz take it to someone who is going to know what to do. Sounds like the cam or timing belt wasn't installed correctly.

[boricuaccord]

double check timing and valve adjustment, you sure you adjusted the valves correctly? the shop had it for two months? are they retarded? take it to somebody who knows what they are doing or put the stock cam back in and see if you still have the problem. you it should idle just fine on the stock ecu. good luck!

sorry for the 2 diff usernames. didnt even know i signed up so long ago.

the shop is a performance shop and i've seen alot of their work, but they are more into the nissans and drift scene and not too much about honda's. regardless, a real mechanic should know how to fix it. thats what i dont understand.

when the 272 was installed, the valves were adjusted as per the book to 10 intake and 12 exhaust. but delta camshaft told me to change that to 6 intake and 8 exhaust b/c that would give better response, and to adjust the cam gear to 4 degrees advanced. i did the valve adjustment but i left the cam gear at stock.

ive read a few ppl that have the regrind and they are fine with a stock ecu. as far as i now, the regrind is not overly aggresive to be throwin everythin in a loop.

[rexload]

I would put the stock cam in there (if you have one) and see if you still have the problem, it takes ~30min to swap the cam.
The reason why I suggested to double check your valve adjustment is because MAYBE you were adjusting cyl 4 when cyl 2 was at tdc(just an example) just a thought...since you said you checked everything else that is related to the cam install

and sorry if this sounds dumb but are you sure you have no vacuum leaks?

[boricuaccord]

I would put the stock cam in there (if you have one) and see if you still have the problem, it takes ~30min to swap the cam.
The reason why I suggested to double check your valve adjustment is because MAYBE you were adjusting cyl 4 when cyl 2 was at tdc(just an example) just a thought...since you said you checked everything else that is related to the cam install

yeah, i thought that too. but the valves were adjusted twice and double checked as well to make sure that wasnt the issue. i still have the stock camshaft, so i will have to try that. i might just pick up the car and bring it back home. i aint gonna pay them when they haven't found me a solution.

i did drive the car a lil and its got power, the only issue is at anytime the idle is under 1500, it will shut off if i dont rev it

[boricuaccord]

bump.

can anyone else think of something that can help me out here

[GameChewer]

im stumped pm NightWolf or Tn_accord

[ACCLUDE91]

First of all, get it to run with the factory ECU first before trying the Apexi or chipped ECU. Sure, it won't let you pull maximum power out of the engine, but IT WILL RUN IT!

Also, your idle is going to be slightly higher with the 272 anyways (about 1000-1500). It's not absolutely required, but highly recommended to use upgraded valve springs. OEM or aftermarket springs you will still have to adjust the valve lash several times within the first six months of having that cam in. You are fine with the .06 & .08 but a slightly larger gap like .07/.09 or .08/.10 would also be fine. But this is not the cause of your issue now......just some extra info for you.

I'm not trying to question your experience and expertise, but it is screaming out a timing issue such as cam timing which you said is currently at stock timing. It should still be able to run at 0 deg., but that cam is designed more for mid/high end power which means that you should get your best results with 2-4 degrees of retard, not advance. You could try retarding a few degrees and see what kind of difference that makes.

Other things to check:
1. the compression to see that the valves are seating properly and it's able to create power under compression.
2. Distributor timing for sure! This could definitely cause it.
3. If your motor is an OBD2, check the crank sensor (the one actually at the crank) to make sure it's connected and reading within range (600-1200 ohms).
4. If the car is OBD1 or OBD2, it couldn't hurt to check the TDC/CKP/CYP in the distributor. Might as well check the coil while you're at it.

Check those and get back with the results

[boricuaccord]

First of all, get it to run with the factory ECU first before trying the Apexi or chipped ECU. Sure, it won't let you pull maximum power out of the engine, but IT WILL RUN IT!

Also, your idle is going to be slightly higher with the 272 anyways (about 1000-1500). It's not absolutely required, but highly recommended to use upgraded valve springs. OEM or aftermarket springs you will still have to adjust the valve lash several times within the first six months of having that cam in. You are fine with the .06 & .08 but a slightly larger gap like .07/.09 or .08/.10 would also be fine. But this is not the cause of your issue now......just some extra info for you.

I'm not trying to question your experience and expertise, but it is screaming out a timing issue such as cam timing which you said is currently at stock timing. It should still be able to run at 0 deg., but that cam is designed more for mid/high end power which means that you should get your best results with 2-4 degrees of retard, not advance. You could try retarding a few degrees and see what kind of difference that makes.

Other things to check:
1. the compression to see that the valves are seating properly and it's able to create power under compression.
2. Distributor timing for sure! This could definitely cause it.
3. If your motor is an OBD2, check the crank sensor (the one actually at the crank) to make sure it's connected and reading within range (600-1200 ohms).
4. If the car is OBD1 or OBD2, it couldn't hurt to check the TDC/CKP/CYP in the distributor. Might as well check the coil while you're at it.

Check those and get back with the results

the car is obd1. i will probably print out the info you posted and take it to the shop. im tired of having to wait so long for something that shouldn't have taken more than a week. now, if i can get it working properly w/out a chipped ecu/tuning/apexi safc, out of all those listed, which would be the better choice? im trying to get these mods to get me the most power possible right now. and then i will move on til maybe even boost. but i need this done first.

mods:

272 delta regrind
aem adjustable cam gear
aem cold air intake
dc header
magnaflow high flow cat
2.25" exhaust pipe into apexi ws2 muffler

[boricuaccord]

bump for some more helpful info

[boricuaccord]

going to the shop in a while to take the information i got from here. if its not fixed by next week friday, car is coming back home and being garage until i can find someone capable to get it running.

[ACCLUDE91]

Hopefully the shop can get it straight.

Since you mentioned possibly going boost, I hate to say it but you'd want to change out that cam! lol But anyways, since you do plan to boost, I'd go the modded ECU route.

If the shop can't get it straight, where are you at? I'm sure someone on here is close by you and could get it going.

[boricuaccord]

Hopefully the shop can get it straight.

Since you mentioned possibly going boost, I hate to say it but you'd want to change out that cam! lol But anyways, since you do plan to boost, I'd go the modded ECU route.

If the shop can't get it straight, where are you at? I'm sure someone on here is close by you and could get it going.

lol... thanx for the info. boost wont come until next year if anything. when i sent the cam out i spoke to steve at delta camshafts and told him i was planning on boostin the car at some point. he said it would be ok b/c he could regrind the cam with that in mind, and not make it as overly aggressive as he would do it on an N/A application. so he said this cam should work well with it b/c it was cut according to the info i provided him, boost being one of the future options.

im in central new jersey. as for the car, i went over there friday and saturday. i printed out the info you posted and took it over there and he said it would be very useful. so far, on saturday, he said they got it idling better and it stays on alot longer than before. he also said it revs up crazy strong. so monday i will see whats going on.

[rexload]

Let us know what they did to get it to idle better,
interested to know what the problem was..