please help!! CEL code 15

[jay92889]

Hey guys, this is my first post as a loooong time reader.

I'm actually having a huge problem with my car, and i really can't afford too have any as my car is the only car in the family right now, not to mention we're short on money. (long story, dad out of town for a while, broke his car before he left and mom's not driving right now)

Anyway, I've got a 1990 Ex auto with around 250k on the original engine/trans.

A few days ago I noticed when i was idling and gassed it a bit sometimes it would not rev too smoothly with the gas, it wasn't too bad but the car would feel like it was wobbling when i gave it constant gas (around 2k rpm) and i'd let off the gas, and try again and it was just fine. It idled just fine at 700rpm.

No big deal, a week later yesterday i was on the freeway and noticed the car at constant speed was jerking softly forward and back, which was a bit weird.. It sort of went away.

Today, i BARELY made it home. The car is idling low around 500 and like total shit doing that wobbly business, and on the road it's just as poor. You can give it gas and it goes nearly nowhere, there's no power, though if you floor it it's fine revving up however.. It just fails to hold power or revs with constant gas. While giving it lots gas it will like rev up SLOWLY and keep jumping up and down as I accelerate, not to mention because of this it was hardly wanting to shift since it was barely accelerating.. NOW GET THIS, when the engine light finally came on the car got MUCH better and ran great. So limp mode makes it run fine?! wtf?! Even with the engine light on it was a bit wobbly but MUCH MUCH BETTER. When I'm going at 35 mph and give it gas, revs will rise as they usually would be lets say 200 rpm as it accelerates, but drop consistently to where they were before. so i'm giving it a lot of gas and it's stopped really accelerating and will continue at the speed i was at! It's still runs a bit smooth as it does this, but it makes a really deep bass noise.

I forgot to mention, also about a week ago my battery light came on. The alternator is putting out power okay, just not so well at idle. if i idle too long my battery drains, and even faster at night with the load of headlights etc. but will never turn ouff, though when i give it gas it's just fine with generating power! I changed the brushes with new ones, what else could this be?! Around the same time this happened the car makes a LOUD humming noise at idle and at freeway speeds it's less noticeable but still there... and another sort of really really faint metal scraping noise when i accelerate from a light..

Right now i've got the dead sucker battery on charge, and i've got a feeling it reset the ecu from being drained from the drive home and headlights being on etc, but i checked for codes and the only one i'm getting right now without starting it is 15.

Usually it throws a buuunch more.

When i give it gas now in park it bounces around from like 1500-1700 and can't make it's mind up.

Can anyone please help as to what's going on?! I'm going to start it and drive it around to see if it'll give me any more codes later...

This car is such a big headache to me... I can't afford for it to shit on me in the next week, finals week. I guess you get what you pay for. It was $700 and needed only an intake gasket when i got it. I've replaced so much shit on this sucker since i got it and as i fix one thing two more will break. what the fuck.

I hate that i love these generation honda accords so much..

[NorcoAccord]

15 Ignition output signal
hmm i would look up ignition output and see what pops up or if you have a Haynes manual see what it says, i didn't really read what you said, too long. I know this isnt any real help but hopefully some can help you.

[BlackPearl2006]

Before I even read the part about your Battery LIght coming on I was already thinking it's the ALTERNATOR going to shyte. Mine did EXACTLY the same thing, and then when the cel light came on, suddenly the car seemed to run fine. So I ignored it for a few more days. And after those few days, the car acted up again and finally died in the middle of driving.

Go test your alternator and/or replace it. The fact that it's putting out "okay" while driving, but "not so good when in idle" means it IS crapping out. It's suppossed to "put out" (lol) sufficiently even at idle speed. It just hasn't fully crapped out yet, but it's on its way.

after that, if it still gives you similar symptoms, I would check your ECM (control module in the distributor) for the erratic tach readings and jumping RPM.

after that, if your still have symptoms, I would have the fuel pump tested. When my fuel pump crapped out on me, I also had similar "wobbling" symptoms (lack of power when accelerating, jumping up and down in revs, etc...).

Hope that helps.

But definitely check out that ALTERNATOR first. I'm pretty sure that's about to crap out on you very soon....as in the next time you drive it! You may have replaced the brushes, but if the voltage regulator is out, or the bearing is bad it's still not gonna generate any output. Just replace the whole thing.

Also, DO NOT DRIVE AT NIGHT. The CB7 cannot run for very long off of just the battery, even with no accesories on. I know this for fact. I had a fully charged battery and it only lasted me less than 20 miles of daytime driving, and less than 10 with headlights on. Might as well spend like $60 on a new/reman alt now rather than get stranded and pay over $100 for a tow truck.

[jay92889]

Thanks a lot! That was very precise and I have a strong feeling you're right about the alternator, but I can't really afford a new or even reman/used one at this current time.. My best bet would probably be the junkyard (which is quickly becoming my second home ), but i wouldn't know what to get! Do my idle battery draining but not killing the car symptoms sound like the voltage regulator or the eletronic load unit? I've searched all around the forums and still can't determine which it is..

At idle kragens told me my output voltage is 12.9 when I had it tested earlier in the week.

Also it's nearly impossible to make it do this now, but when I'm driving and I come off the gas and get on it aggressively maybe 1 out of 10 times the battery light will go off for a good couple seconds.


To confuse things a bit more code 15 is now gone, now it's code 1 and 43.

code 1 = o2 sensor
code 43 = fuel supply system

I've got through maybe 4 different o2 sensors in the past 3 months. Original one made the car bog terribly, then the brand new bosch threw code for the o2 sensor heater (it's wires got shredded two weeks ago by the drive shaft..) Sensor number three was from the junkyard and caused bogging, but it wasn't an oem unit, and sensor number 4 which was oem that i got two weeks ago from a cb7 with 116k miles on it is giving me this now!? It was just fine for the first two weeks..

When I'm driving and the wobbly poor acceleration stuff gets serious enough the CEL comes on and make it run fine again. It also comes on when I'm coasting in gear for a while, so let's say with a freeway exit, it's guaranteed to make the CEL come on! Does this sound familiar to anyone?

Sorry for the long posts, there's so many things wrong with my car i'm beginning to think it's all the domino effect. You can't test one part with confidence that everything else works around it or before it! Gr.

Thanks in advance!

[NorcoAccord]

most will say Bosch are POS, oem o2 sensors are they way to go.

[BlackPearl2006]

For all the trouble it is to remove the old alt and install a different one, you're wasting time and money on a junkyard alt, which may even cost the same as a remanufactured alt, and may still crap out on you since it is as old as the one that's going out. Doesn't make sense to replace an old dying part with another one the same age. The voltage regulator on our alts are internal, so there's no easy way to replace just the regulator. You need the whole alt. No real (cheap) way around it.

That whole thing where the alt light comes on, but then goes off again...and even if you get some good charge out of it on idle, man, I'm telling you, it's going out, and it's gonna be completely dead in like 2 days or less I swear. Don't chance driving it unless you're comfortable getting stranded wherever it dies (drive close to bus lines, main roads, or near places people you know live, so you have a way home at least).

Since the alt is crapping out, it is also possible all other electrically-run systems (which is practically all the systems on the car) will start to throw codes. The 43 code could also mean your main relay needs resoldering/replacement, or, like I mentioned earlier, your fuel pump could be going out at the same time. Everything you described also happened to my car all around the same time. Alt went out, fuel pump, more.... it seems like one thing after another, but it's to be expected with such an old car.

The fun part is, once all this stuff craps out, and you replace each thing one at a time, you know what stuff is wrong with your car, and what is right (after fixing it). So many stuff has crapped out on my car that I can more easily narrow down now what problems it has because I've replaced like 75% of the systems as they've begun to fail after now finally 17 years of service. That's why I'll never get rid of this car. I've fixed more stuff on it now than there is left to go wrong with it. And once I finish fixing off those remaining things, most of the systems will be restored and in like-new condition. (Plus after putting all that into it, it seems a waste to just junk/sell it and buy another crappy car for what little you'd get out of selling it, only to come with a whole new set of problems).

Back to business: replace your alt. If there is a major price difference, for now, just to get it goin, at least use a functioning junkyard alt (have it tested first). But if the price is near the same as a reman, just spring for the reman at least. Alts are sensative. Heck, you can buy a whole brand-spankin new alt ,and it can still crap out on you a day after installing it.

But replace that alt, man. Our cars really caNNOT run on just battery power. When I forced mine to drive all the way home on battery power, I'm pretty sure the ECU cut out, and I got smoking and all sorts of crappy things happening under the hood. Don't chance it man.

Replace the alt, replace the alt......or stop driving it until you can afford a new alt. If you can't afford a new alt right now, make some arrangements for alternative transportation immediately.

That's my advice from recent personal experience.

Oh yeah, x2 on O2 Sensors crapping out on you: used ones (which are also as old and used as the one you're replacing) won't function for much longer than yours already did, and yeah, everyone seems to say non OEM (including Bosch) replacements are worthless.

[Fake Thug]

Your charging system voltage is too low. Should be 14v. That alt is bad. Code 15 is ignition output. Most likely the igniter. The dizzy o ring might be leaking oil and shorting the igniter . Pull the cap off and look with a flashlight. You might also see a trail of oil right under your distributor.

[benji]

Like it's been said, get a new alternator. Many places will give you a core for bringing in your old and busted one, making something that is $120 only $40 afterwards. So, it might suck for an hour or so, but you get that money back.

I think that once you replace the alt, you will be good as far as the other things failing; they are probably just not getting enough juice right now. If you swing by the junkyard, you ought to snag an ignitor or two and just pocket them; they are worth just holding on to.