90 CB7 vs RSX

[CB7 Sleeper]

put the cars on a dyno and it's no longer a ''drivers race''.

just compare dyno's. look at the torque curve. they make power in different ways.

i think i need to stop this convo because it isn't doing any good.

people just won't understand things that make the motor better. things like better powerband, adjustable cam gear, better head flow, responds to bolt-ons better, ect. things the h doesn't have, and they still try to say they're the same. you can do things with the k that you can't do with the h. later.

True, about what he K has over the H.

But stock engine vs. stock engine the power output is nearly the same. All I'm saying.

[94b20gsr]

All I'm saying is, how is more stock hp(210hp for 05-06rsx) with a better powerband equal? Repeating it doesn't make it so...

[fatboy1185]

All I'm saying is, how is more stock hp(210hp for 05-06rsx) with a better powerband equal? Repeating it doesn't make it so...

You're forgetting to look at the torque, which moves the car.

And the better power band is due to gearing for the most part.

I will continue to repeat that til you understand.

[94b20gsr]

Actually, the gearing has nothing to do with the factory crank horsepower rating, and your forgetting that the peak torque is irrelevant if it doesn't carry very far, and you can take both trannies off and put them on engine dyno's and it will be the same, gearing doesn't magically make the powerband better on a car, it may accent it, you guys are also forgetting that shorter gears are only better up until a certain point where shifting constantly negates the advantages. Powerband has nothing to do with a tranny...that comes from the motor, the tranny multiplies the power of the motor, not makes power for the motor. And again, repeating ignorance does not equate to the truth.

[fatboy1185]

Actually, the gearing has nothing to do with the factory crank horsepower rating, and your forgetting that the peak torque is irrelevant if it doesn't carry very far, and you can take both trannies off and put them on engine dyno's and it will be the same, gearing doesn't magically make the powerband better on a car, it may accent it, you guys are also forgetting that shorter gears are only better up until a certain point where shifting constantly negates the advantages. Powerband has nothing to do with a tranny...that comes from the motor, the tranny multiplies the power of the motor, not makes power for the motor. And again, repeating ignorance does not equate to the truth.

Which is exactly what I've been tying to say. K20 makes a few more horses, while the H22 makes a few more torque.

The reason a stock rsx is faster than a stock prelude is GEARING!!! It multiplies the torque, thus resulting in quicker acceleration.

Taken directly from Mfactory's website:http://www.teammfactory.com/products...0Drive%20Gears

OEM 4.266 Final Drive--- 158lbft --- 158lbft --- 0% --- 70mph @ 3500rpm

MFactory 5.15 Final Drive --- 158lbft --- 191lbft ---21% --- 70mph @ 4300rpm

21% increase in torque, due to gearing alone.

[94b20gsr]

You still fail to understand, I'm sorry you can't be helped. The factory HP AND TQ are rated WITHOUT a tranny...not after multiplying. You just latch on tight to that h22, don't ever let anyone tell you it's not the best thing Honda ever did, and Especially, don't listen to logic about it versus other motors. If you can't see then I'm done, not worth my time, maybe one day your eyes will open.

[fatboy1185]

You still fail to understand, I'm sorry you can't be helped. The factory HP AND TQ are rated WITHOUT a tranny...not after multiplying. You just latch on tight to that h22, don't ever let anyone tell you it's not the best thing Honda ever did, and Especially, don't listen to logic about it versus other motors. If you can't see then I'm done, not worth my time, maybe one day your eyes will open.

Yeah, I got that the first time, but what does that have to do with our argument? That a Stock K20 has MORE horsepower but LESS torque than a stock H22a??? We established that on the first page I'm pretty sure. So tell me, how does an engine with a few more horsepower but less torque, OWN at the track???

[94b20gsr]

Who said own? Superior, yes. Didn't say own, read again.

[fatboy1185]

both. stock form, and with bolt-ons K20Z1 owns H22a

Who said own? Superior, yes. Didn't say own, read again.

Oh sweet mother, did you even read this thread? Did you not see the comment that made me start responding? Don't jump in a conversation if you aren't 100% clear of what the discussion is about.

[CB7 Sleeper]

Oh sweet mother, did you even read this thread? Did you not see the comment that made me start responding? Don't jump in a conversation if you aren't 100% clear of what the discussion is about.

X2!

How about reading genius. Look at the gearing and how high the K revs compared to the H. That is where it makes the power, and where it lacks the torque. So it WILL be repeated again and again, the RSXs advantage is in the GEARING! HP does not move the car, as fatboy1185 stated, TQ moves the car. At the track, it is what matters. HP plays a role too, but TQ, as stated before, moves the car!

Way to jump into an argument when you have no idea what the last 2 pages have been about. You came into the argument with no new information to provide, and tried to argue a point that has already been proven false long before this argument even transpired.

Who said own? Superior, yes. Didn't say own, read again.

both. stock form, and with bolt-ons K20Z1 owns H22a

Who should read again? Look here Mr. Stubborn Pants-

both. stock form, and with bolt-ons K20Z1 owns H22a

See this quote? Yea that's right bud, the one right above where I am typing. This is what is being discussed right now. So hows about you let the big boys talk. Sound good?

[TypeG]

you guys know that you're quoting two different people right? lol. later.

[fatboy1185]

you guys know that you're quoting two different people right? lol. later.

Lol yes. My original response was to the person who said K20 owns H22. That's who I tried to start the debate with. Third parties then entered the convo.

[CB7 Sleeper]

Lol yes. My original response was to the person who said K20 owns H22. That's who I tried to start the debate with. Third parties then entered the convo.

Well, don't consider me a third party. I was merely there to provide back up, because I look at it the same way you do, and I had information relevant to the argument, unlike smart guy that literally, just entered the argument.

94b20gsr isn't providing any information related to the current argument at all. He doesn't seem to understand the importance of TQ and how it directly correlates with HP. TQ is what moves the car, PERIOD. A car can have 300 HP, but with 0 lb/ft of TQ, the car isn't going anywhere, unless it weighs 0 pounds. I am only hypothetically speaking though.

Just think about it. The few more HP the K20 in a base model RSX (since that is the application we have been referring to in this whole thread) puts down cannot compete with the amount of TQ the H22a provides to the crank over the K.

So, if both engines, completely stock, are mounted in 2 cars that weigh the same, with the same gearing, with the same driver, that shifts at the same RPM, which one will win in the 1/4 mile? The 1/8 mile? On a roll from 40 mph? On a roll from 60 mph? On a roll from 80 mph? This is a more realistic way to compare the engines. Think about it this way and what do you find? That's what I thought.

[TypeG]

all you keep talking about is torque. based on that, how would it even be possible for a k20 powered car to pass an h22 powerd car? what do you think makes them different? it's the way they make power. the torque curve.

surely you don't think both cars have the same torque curve?

if it were based on a torque number, then the rsx would never stand a chance.

how is it i have dozens of video's on youtube showing the k20 pulling hard on h22's, yet the cars weigh the same and NONE of them have passengers like the k20 powered car?

what's going to happen when one motor's torque curve begins to drop and the other motor's keeps going up? even though one may have an overall lower torque number? a dyno comparison will show you. later.

[fatboy1185]

all you keep talking about is tourqe. based on that, how would it even be possible for a k20 powered car to pass an h22 powerd car? what do you think makes them different? it's the way they make power. the torque curve.

surely you don't think both cars have the same tourqe curve?

if it were based on a torque number, then the rsx would never stand a chance.

how is it i have dozens of video's on youtube showing the k20 pulling hard on h22's, yet the cars weigh the same and NONE of them have passengers like the k20 powered car?

what's going to happen when one motor's torque curve begins to drop and the other motor's keeps going up? even though one may have an overall lower torque number? a dyno comparison will show you. later.

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