'08 Accord

[owequitit]

FF can be fun, but ultimately, it will get to a point where you have a choice...steer, or accelerate. But that is another thread.

Actually that point is reached in any car.

Testing and racing would indicate that this point is not necessarily lower in a FF car.

One of the things that allowed the TL and the Civic SI to win not only their classes at the 25 Hours of Thunderhill, but to place extremely well overall were the faster lap times they were able to run. I will have to go back and look, but the TL effort was actually running down a car ahead of it at a fairly rapid pace. They didn't want to push the car that hard though, because it had a stock radiator. They knew they could have caught it though.

Considering the classes are fairly equally prepped, this would indicate that there wasn't as much of a disadvantage as thought.

The TSX's tearing up the SCCA World Challenge against FR Bimmers and other cars would indicate this also. Even wearing hefty amounts of reward weight, it is hard to keep them off the podium.

How about the lower classes of SCCA where FWD old tech Hondas still do very well?

Realistically, the main difference between FR and FF are the driving styles needed to achieve the quickest times. FF requires better energy management.

I hate to fall back on magazines, but they usually are the best source for competing gathered info. Notice that in the last luxury car comparo for C&D with the new IS350 and 3 series that the TL had the highest skidpad grip?

Considering the nature of a steady state circle under power, which is what the skidpad is, it would seem to be a good test of overall cornering ability. That is one reason they do it.

Really it is semantics. There are some disadvantaes to FWD, but I can make a list equally long about AWD and RWD. It really is about preference.

The average person has been conditioned to believe by each respective marketing dept that their respective system is better.

The main thing that makes a car handle better/worse is weight.

Realistically, a capable driver in the hands of any one could win the race.

My personal preference is for RWD, but I am not going to not buy a good car because it is FWD.

I know that there isn't that big of a difference, especially in everyday driving, and that driving style is far more important.

I have also never had traction issues in the snow in my car.

[NutBucket]

Nobody is going to dispute that an FF car can't be fast. And yes, some of those race-prepped Hondas are definitely fast. However, just to make an obvious point, why don't we see FF used in any form of racing beyond SCCA? Yes, there is FF used in Rally Racing (separate class of course) and yes, sometimes they are faster than the AWD cars.

Being an AWD fan, I'll gladly admit there are some major drawbacks such as added weight, driveline loss and space. My car's trunk is really much smaller than it could be due to the rear diff.

And yes, launching AWD is tricky as well. I've only really done it well once and that's more because I'm a bit weary of frying my clutch. And I'm definitely aware of some people snapping half-shafts and such.

We can all agree to agree and disagree

Funny thing though, when I was car shopping, I knew I didn't want a FWD car. That automatically excluded MANY cars, of course. I doubt I'll always be that picky....at least as far as drive wheels are concerned.

[owequitit]

Nobody is going to dispute that an FF car can't be fast. And yes, some of those race-prepped Hondas are definitely fast. However, just to make an obvious point, why don't we see FF used in any form of racing beyond SCCA? Yes, there is FF used in Rally Racing (separate class of course) and yes, sometimes they are faster than the AWD cars.

Being an AWD fan, I'll gladly admit there are some major drawbacks such as added weight, driveline loss and space. My car's trunk is really much smaller than it could be due to the rear diff.

And yes, launching AWD is tricky as well. I've only really done it well once and that's more because I'm a bit weary of frying my clutch. And I'm definitely aware of some people snapping half-shafts and such.

We can all agree to agree and disagree

Funny thing though, when I was car shopping, I knew I didn't want a FWD car. That automatically excluded MANY cars, of course. I doubt I'll always be that picky....at least as far as drive wheels are concerned.

I wasn't really trying to disagree, LOL. I am just playing devils advocate.

The SCCA is pretty much as far out as you can get on anything resembling a stock chassis. The higher class (with Vipers ETC), is actually the first step to not really being stock anymore. The Cadillas CTS-V's that are campaigned are a good example as are the Audi's. They are extremely modified chassis wise to make them competitive with the other cars.

The FF architecture is used in several European classes of racing as well as Asian classes of racing.

Oddly, I believe the Acuras are some of the least modified cars in that class, at least they were.

You don't see more pure from the ground up FF racing applications because the inherent physical advantages of FF aren't on a race track. When you are really squeezing every last bit of performance from a chassis (as in F1 or Indy for example), THEN the inherent disadvantages of FF will hold you back. But then again, they don't really use AWD outside of special forms of racing either.

The added weight and drivetrain loss from an AWD system will do the same thing.

But at anywhere near stock, or even modified to some degree, it is still a driver's race.

I don't mind AWD or RWD or FWD. I have seen them all equally tear each other up.

Like I said, I am just playing devil's advocate. Actually, one of the cars at the top of my list is the Subie Legacy GT. As long as they don't mess up the styling...

[NutBucket]

A wise choice That's what I sold the Accord for Anyway, if the US version follows the Euro/JDM versions, the revised styling we should get next year is more of an evolution of the current design. It still looks very nice





All Euro-market shots but that should be approximately what we receive for '08

[owequitit]

A wise choice That's what I sold the Accord for Anyway, if the US version follows the Euro/JDM versions, the revised styling we should get next year is more of an evolution of the current design. It still looks very nice





All Euro-market shots but that should be approximately what we receive for '08

I can live with that.

I just don't like what they did with B9 and the "new" WRX.

I can live with the WRX, but the B9 is just butt ugly.

They really hit the mark with the Legacy I think. That is probably what that redesign is so conservative.

[NutBucket]

It's just a mid-cycle refresh really. Like everything else, just jealous of all the options you can get overseas, but not here. Oh well, the grass is always greener.....

[owequitit]

It's just a mid-cycle refresh really. Like everything else, just jealous of all the options you can get overseas, but not here. Oh well, the grass is always greener.....

Yeah, that always bugged me too. Honda is just as notorious for that.

You would think that with this being the largest car market in the world by far, they would want to offer some of that stuff here.

But I guess the American buyer is fickle, so the are less likely to take chances...

It does look decent. I have like the current gen Legacy since I saw pre-release shots from Japan, although, I almost like the current ones better than that MMC.

[NutBucket]

I think I figured it out though. I think Americans are just cheap and aren't willing to pay for all those options. That, and most don't care about how their car is equipped. They look for a few key features and that's all that really matters. How many people really order the exact car they want anyway?

[lokuputha]

This thing looks like it should have a million horsepower and eat ferraris for breakfast

[owequitit]

I think I figured it out though. I think Americans are just cheap and aren't willing to pay for all those options. That, and most don't care about how their car is equipped. They look for a few key features and that's all that really matters. How many people really order the exact car they want anyway?

Yeah probably. Look how many cars are bought by old people who just let them sit in the garage, and drive them 500 miles a year.

[GHOST 2.2]

the back looks awesome....but the frontend plays a big factor.. if it turns out like the new skyline concept might as well flush that idea down the drain.

[f22a4bandit]

That's a very sexy design.

[owequitit]

the back looks awesome....but the frontend plays a big factor.. if it turns out like the new skyline concept might as well flush that idea down the drain.

I am sure the front will go with it just fine...

[owequitit]

http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=642060

Here is some more advanced speculation about the next Euro Accord/TSX.

If the next TSX really looks like that, I may just have to buy one!