dohcb7... WARNING

[deevergote]

I have re-opened this thread against my better judgement. I just don't think it's fair to reply when I know I'm getting in the final word.


If you choose to reply to this thread, PLEASE think very carefully about what you are going to say before you say it. If it doesn't NEED to be said, don't say anything. The whole idea of "I read the rules but they don't apply to me" doesn't exactly make me pee with happiness.

[Shadow1]

i see what Deev is saying. if i were to buy soemthing from someone up here and they took too long to get back to me id give them the benfit of the doubt. maybe something happened to them or a family member. maybe they've been trying to get it shipped off but couldnt within the reasonable amount of time.

once you call someone a scammer its like calling a black man a n***er. or calling someone trailer trash. they'll act like it and take off. they're thinking: "well since he wants to call me one then il act like one. ive tried but it enough for him." so most people dont have that mature mentality to say "lets see if i can settle this in an adult way."

but if you get scammed, sorry to hear it. with me, i dont do business with anyone whos been here for less than like 6 months. post count dont mean nothing. they can be the most honest person on the planet but only have a count of 30. maybe they werent able to get to a computer all that often. i know ive in that situation before.

before you haul off and call someone a scammer, give them some time to get back to you. if you send numorous PMs and emails but they dont get back to you, maybe they havent been online. i normaly look at when the last time they were online. now if you've sent hundreds of emails and PMs and they were on that day then yeah, they're doing it purposely. there should be no reason they would "forget" about something their selling.

but wait a little bit before calling someone a scammer.

[4thgenaccord]

I have re-opened this thread against my better judgement. I just don't think it's fair to reply when I know I'm getting in the final word.


If you choose to reply to this thread, PLEASE think very carefully about what you are going to say before you say it. If it doesn't NEED to be said, don't say anything. The whole idea of "I read the rules but they don't apply to me" doesn't exactly make me pee with happiness.

IMO I think that the very creation of this thread deserves a ban, especially since the OP stats that they know it's against the rules and they don't care. JMO. Deev you run this board very well and I in no way am trying to under mind your decision to keep this thread open.


On the note of the actual warning. I thought there was a thread in the classified forums for just such a thing?

[ChIoVnIdCa]

How I see it


To busy or ran out of money to ship something/ family emergency is never an excuse. If you don't have the time to ship something out in a reasonable amount of time don't sell. In the "real world" family emergencys don't matter. You have to take care of your business. And ran out of money to ship... just lol




If you get "scammed" there is no reason to create a thread bashing someone or making one to see if anyone has talked to this person or lives near them (even if you state in the title "not to bash blank" / "I know the rules but...." )
Its against the forum rules that you agreed to when you entered the password and you should be banned for just ignoring them




If you are out your twenty dollars or w/e it is you should take legal action on your own. Contact an agency to help you, write some letters, contact the local police where that person live or where you live. Maybe someone will care.

[deevergote]

There was such a thread, as well as one saying who was good to buy from... until I started getting complaints from people saying "your thread said they were ok!"

The threads became grounds for flaming (the "don't buy" thread) as well as a sorry excuse for trusting someone you have no good reason to trust (icedriceraccord got his stuff from slammdvindiesel, so I can trust him too!)




Equate it to sex (as the two things that can ruin lives the most are money and sex). Would you have unprotected sex with a girl just because the previous 10 guys who did didn't seem to get anything from her? Would that be a good reason to trust it? If you catch yourself a nasty case of herpes, would you expect me to feel sorry for you?


This board is not a marketplace. I allow people to buy and sell because it's a good thing. I expect people to understand the risk, and avoid such dealings if they aren't willing to accept it. There is no protection here. All I can offer is education. If you choose to ignore that education and not take proper care, I have no sympathy.


"yeah, but I want to warn people..." bullshit. I DID warn people. EVERY person that has entered that Classifieds section has been warned. If they didn't read, then they deserve to get scammed, as they scammed themselves already by bypassing the warning. If you get scammed after reading the disclaimer, after accepting the risk, that sucks... but you did it, and you had other options available to you (ebay, for example).




And honestly (forgot to add this to the initial reply), what would a moderated feedback forum do (aside from creating a TON of work and headaches for the unlucky moderator that got stuck with the thankless job...)? How many "scammers" have successfully sold things on here? How many "scammers" have scammed on their first try? Not many. Most of them have sold a number of times. Not all, I'm sure... but many. The one "chronic scammer" I have in mind has had more positive transactions than negative.


If you want a moderated feedback forum, there will be a fee to use the classifieds, paid directly to the moderator running the feedback forum. I wouldn't expect anyone to do that job for free. (this is hypothetical. I have no intention of making such a forum)

[ChIoVnIdCa]

The one "chronic scammer" I have in mind has had more positive transactions than negative.

wonders if I know who this is

[deevergote]

How I see it


To busy or ran out of money to ship something/ family emergency is never an excuse. If you don't have the time to ship something out in a reasonable amount of time don't sell. In the "real world" family emergencys don't matter. You have to take care of your business. And ran out of money to ship... just lol

It's not a good excuse, you're right. Fizzbob7 once said that when you're doing business, that comes first. Your dog could get run over, your grandmother could die, and your daughter could be coughing up blood and shitting razorblades... The person who sent you money still expects their stuff.

However, in the real world, not everyone adheres to that. In the real world, you think "crap, I was supposed to ship that today!" or "crap, I'm just so busy with work and school that I don't have time to ship!"
Right? No. You should ship the stuff ASAP. But did you? No. Will you? Probably not for another few days. Are you right? No. Will you be upset if you come back and see 25 people talking bad about you on the internet because you were busy? Certainly. Will you be upset enough to just say "screw it, I'm not coming back here anyway"? Maybe not, but some people would (and have).


You see, I'm not defending the actions of the "scammers" (or would be scammers, depending on the situation). I'm accepting the fact that MOST people do not have an overwhelming sense of duty and responsibility. They do not feel that they owe the buyer a prompt delivery. I can't control what people do, I can only anticipate it, and try to educate those that might not understand it. Who knows, maybe someone will actually learn something from this site that can be applied to life.

[hondaccordgrl]

I <3 u deeve

[verothacamaro]

mindless unconditional acceptance of "law"

/madspleen85's personal power of judgement

speechless....

[sulimed]

[IMG]http://www.rickbranson.com/random/****.jpg[/IMG]

[accordaffair]

did those guys put insta-tan on or something?

[verothacamaro]

I'm just now seeing this, and I will respond.

Justin, you of all people should be able to see further than that...


You sell something on a forum. Something happens and you don't ship in a reasonable amount of time. For whatever reason, you can't or don't contact the buyers. Sucks. But it happens when you deal with individuals.

When you FINALLY get a chance to go back to try to clear things up and see your name attached to a 5 page thread flaming you to hell, what do you do? Send the parts? Refund the money? Or say "fuck you guys, you've already labeled me a thief, so I'm walking!"

Most people, when parting out their car, or simply leaving the community for some reason, will opt for #3.




How do I know this? Because I've seen it happen. I can think of two specific members off the top of my head that have done just that.

Fair? No. But the "scammer" threads about them ended up being self-fulfilling prophecies. They weren't officially scammers until they saw they had been labeled as such. Then they just kept everything.

So yeah, if you get scammed, that sucks. You should've protected yourself better. You're taking a risk by buying from unknown people with no form of security.



Most scammers disappear after they do their deed. I know of one chronic scammer on here, and all the alerts in the world haven't stopped people from buying from him anyway. If someone comes back, they probably never intended to scam anyone.

If you have a question about the status of your purchase, you can always ask nicely in the for sale thread where it is. That will be enough of an alert for anyone who searches.

If you purchased a TV from Best Buy, and they told you 3-5 days shipping, yet they failed to ship your product within that time frame, and in fact shipped it 1.5 months thereafter, would you not complain to Best Buy? of course you would....

What a lot (maybe not most) of people would do is tell as many people as possible of their negative experience, and typically other people are grateful of such a notice.

Typically you tell 4 people of a good reaction....and 11 of a negative. I think we would all want to know of a scam, if it happened to one of our members. I'd praise them for the warning.

This gives us the comfort knowing the actual amount of risk involved with a transaction....

welcome feedback on ebay......without it, trust would be in the minds of the naive. so everyone is just as gullible as the next, and ebay would not exist as our favorite online marketplace......

[deevergote]

And you totally missed my point. I'm done explaining myself.

Best Buy is a store. It is not an individual. Best Buy's grandmother doesn't die unexpectedly. Best Buy doesn't lose it's internet connection for 2 weeks.

Re-locked. From now on, "so-and-so scammed me" threads result in a week's ban. They're not allowed because:
a) they don't "alert" anyone to a problem. They just tell people about members that will never return, and make REAL scammers out of members that might have legitimately screwed up.

b) They result in 20 people getting involved in an issue that only involves 2 people.

And
c) Everyone begins to think they know the best way to run this forum. Bottom line is, you do not. If you have "Moderator" under your name, I will take your words seriously, but even then, it's my decision. Anyone else, enjoy your free site.