Politics & Religion Thread – KEEP IT FRIENDLY

[Ghostyman]

And what about someone who dies before they can even grasp the concept of religion. Say if someone under the age of five dies, do they go to hell for all eternity because they didn't believe in God?

According to a lot of Christians, they don't go to hell. Unbaptized infants who die spend eternity in "Limbo" along with the souls of good people who died before the Ressurection (these people, but not the babies, may eventually leave Limbo for Heaven). I believe the Catholic Church is currently evaluating whether or not to abandon the idea of Limbo.

There's also Purgatory, where good people go before they go to Heaven. Since they died with sins, they have to atone for those sins by spending varying amounts of time in Purgatory. Once you've paid your dues in Purgatory, you get to go to Heaven.

[Ghostyman]

^^^ survival of the fittest is just one of the laws of nature,which means that when you have no foundation (spiritually i mean) your next instinct is to live by any means which can lead the human race to it self destruction.or in other words kill or be killed,and i never said because you believe in god puts you above anyone else and are exempt from anything,but if you think money will save you spiritually than by all means go for it,why is it that the most poor people in the world are the most spiritual,maybe its because they strive to recognize that theres more to life than just flesh and bones.

Hmm, I bet if you asked most poor people, they'd tell you they'd rather be rich.

The bible does say it's easier for "a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of Heaven." A cynic might point out that the Church benefits greatly from policies like these.

Also, you can't really use "survival of the fittest" in that sense. The concept of "survival of the fittest" doesn't apply to individuals, only populations changing over time. Traits which benefit members of that population will increase and traits which are detrimental will decrease because individuals with beneficial traits will tend to reproduce more. Using it outside of that context is erroneous.

[Shuebakka]

^^^ survival of the fittest is just one of the laws of nature,which means that when you have no foundation (spiritually i mean) your next instinct is to live by any means which can lead the human race to it self destruction.or in other words kill or be killed,and i never said because you believe in god puts you above anyone else and are exempt from anything,but if you think money will save you spiritually than by all means go for it,why is it that the most poor people in the world are the most spiritual,maybe its because they strive to recognize that theres more to life than just flesh and bones.

It seems a lot of the richest people are very spiritual as well. And I never said that I thought that money would save me, if you knew me you'd know that I think the opposite. Fuck money. Who needs it? Oh wait, we all do. Yet the sad truth is that money and power are the main things that drive us. George W. Bush is an extremely religious man and in fact told the people of Iraq on one of his visits that he is doing what he is doing because "God told me to."

[Ghostyman]

There is no degree of sin so to speak, in God's eyes. Sin is sin, and if you have not asked for forgiveness and acepted him as your lord and saviour, no amount of goodness can get you into the gates of heaven. I state this in post #122. ^ ^ ^

There are degrees of sin. First off, there are "mortal sins" and "venial sins". The venial sins are the more minor of the two. Each different sin carries with it a temporal punishment. This penalty is the time you spend in Purgatory before you get to go to Heaven. You can shorten your stay in Purgatory with indulgences (familiar to anyone who's seen Dogma) and by having people say prayers for the dead for you.

[laz93se]

^^^ yes the poor man would rather be rich which is an obvious question but at the cost of what,thier spirituality, i really doubt it.and yes i did use the survival of the fittest out of context but it was just a quick phrase that i used to describe the way some people lived as the human race progressed.in my professional field of work i deal with many people who are well off not super rich but enough to secure thier children and grandchildrens future and about 80% percent of them have basically the same thoughts about god and religion which is (example)yeah i believe in god but ah......
and thier mind goes blank.they are more focused on things that when you die you cant take with you.and only think of how to better them selves.

[Ghostyman]

^^^ yes the poor man would rather be rich which is an obvious question but at the cost of what,thier spirituality, i really doubt it

So, what are you saying? Do poor people want to be rich or not?

[uslspct]

Survival of the fittest is a great phrase. Nowaways everything is PC(here at least) and everyone thinks we should help all the poor, helpless, dying, etc. Our species is slowly, being diluted with those that should not have survived including many of the rich who only exist for money. In order to evolve or "advance" further, if you believe that we have indeed evolved since way back when, if not physically then at least socially and scientifically, then we need to recognize that everything and everyone are not equal. That there is an ugly side to life that is as important as the nice side. Some people should not survive past a certain point. We're able to brake that cardinal rule of nature now and look what's happening.
The realization to change our ways is not gonna happen in this country though, we never get to see real strife. We're too busy shopping. Actually it's never going to happen, anywhere. Religion is too powerful in most places and in some places, like Africa, the damage has already been done. And with China's and India's economy booming and slowly turning into more like us, forget about it.
There are too many people being born compared to the amount dying. Our species is doomed to destroy itself, at least back into primitive times. Which acutally is what we need, IMO.
Wow, reading back, that was really negative. Oh well, if you believe in a balance in everything, I'll be the yin and Acclude91 can be the yang.
Maybe that was a rant, but give me a break it's 5:45am.
10 pages here we come.

[laz93se]

like i said in my last post when some people reach a certain plateau in the material world they tend to lose contact with their spiritual side and forget their purpose or meaning in life.(example) the poor man wants to become rich but he is spiritually happy and in balance with god.so the poor man changes his focus and works very hard to become rich and in turn he loses his spiritual self and is consumed by what drives him (money),and one day he loses everything and his world crumbles before him and now has lost all purpose in life.=would he still have chosen that route if he knew what was most important in life,spiritual enlightenment.


i'am not saying that you can not be wealthy and spiritual but i think you must have a very strong foundation (knowledge of self ) and of god.

[laz93se]

i'am hitting the sack mang the screen looks blurry,i can't even spell right.

[Accord R33]

Survival of the fittest is a great phrase. Nowaways everything is PC(here at least) and everyone thinks we should help all the poor, helpless, dying, etc. Our species is slowly, being diluted with those that should not have survived including many of the rich who only exist for money. In order to evolve or "advance" further, if you believe that we have indeed evolved since way back when, if not physically then at least socially and scientifically, then we need to recognize that everything and everyone are not equal. That there is an ugly side to life that is as important as the nice side. Some people should not survive past a certain point. We're able to brake that cardinal rule of nature now and look what's happening.
The realization to change our ways is not gonna happen in this country though, we never get to see real strife. We're too busy shopping. Actually it's never going to happen, anywhere. Religion is too powerful in most places and in some places, like Africa, the damage has already been done. And with China's and India's economy booming and slowly turning into more like us, forget about it.
There are too many people being born compared to the amount dying. Our species is doomed to destroy itself, at least back into primitive times. Which acutally is what we need, IMO.
Wow, reading back, that was really negative. Oh well, if you believe in a balance in everything, I'll be the yin and Acclude91 can be the yang.
Maybe that was a rant, but give me a break it's 5:45am.
10 pages here we come.

I actually agree with you here, though the few people i have ever expressed this too called me a complete ass hole for thinking like that...


its actually the same mentality i have against vegans who wont eat meat because of the poor little furry animals. Its called the food chain, the circle of life, survival of the fittest....its just the way things are. i bet if those animals had the ability to eat us, they would do it in a heart beat.

[deevergote]

I totally agree with the survival of the fittest. However, compassion is a quality (and a strength) that we have over animals. Helping the weak, the poor, the hungry... that's not necessarily a weakness. Help a weak man get stronger, you have an ally for life. Find a cure for a horrible disease, and when YOU develop that disease, you'll be cured.

Stupidity is another matter, however. THAT is the true weakness of the human being. If you die because you overdosed on recreational drugs, you're stupid. If you die because you threw yourself off a cliff with or without a parachute, you're stupid. If you die because you can't take the stress of life anymore, you're stupid. We don't need that passed down. Unfortunately, we can't purge the world of stupidity. The sad thing is that the current "protective" state we're in allows for stupid people to live without danger. The dumber you are, the easier it is for you to just bumble along unharmed (drinking on the job and not getting fired, for example...)

[Accord R33]

(drinking on the job and not getting fired, for example...)

lmao

[midnightrayne]

Here is what I have always wondered but I know it could never happen, but let me pose a what if. What if you took a child right after they were born and put them in a room and all the contact they had while growing and never mentioned the word God or expressed any religious believes to this child. What I would like to see is they say God is in our hearts, which would mean we do not have to really be taught god he is with us from day one. I would like to see if that child ever asked what is God. I know it’s something that couldn’t happen because even in a household that might not believe you are going to here about religion and god from other sources school other family even the TV, one way or another. I think it would be a neat test to see if god is something we are born with.

[maroonaccord2.2]

According to a lot of Christians, they don't go to hell. Unbaptized infants who die spend eternity in "Limbo" along with the souls of good people who died before the Ressurection (these people, but not the babies, may eventually leave Limbo for Heaven). I believe the Catholic Church is currently evaluating whether or not to abandon the idea of Limbo.

There's also Purgatory, where good people go before they go to Heaven. Since they died with sins, they have to atone for those sins by spending varying amounts of time in Purgatory. Once you've paid your dues in Purgatory, you get to go to Heaven.

Baptism I believe, if for those that are metally capable of grasping the concept of what baptism IS. I was baptised at 7 years of age, an at that age I knew I would walk with Christ forever. Babies, infants, and young children that do not comprehend "God" or can't even talk cannot be held accountable for sin, they don't know what SIN is.

I don't believe there is an " in limbo" stage. Why would there be, God died for our sins so that we would not have to suffer for them..... that was the whole point of his sacrifice! He loves us so much it's incredible.

[phatdoughnut]

^^^ yes the poor man would rather be rich which is an obvious question but at the cost of what,thier spirituality, i really doubt it.and yes i did use the survival of the fittest out of context but it was just a quick phrase that i used to describe the way some people lived as the human race progressed.in my professional field of work i deal with many people who are well off not super rich but enough to secure thier children and grandchildrens future and about 80% percent of them have basically the same thoughts about god and religion which is (example)yeah i believe in god but ah......
and thier mind goes blank.they are more focused on things that when you die you cant take with you.and only think of how to better them selves.

I have to dissagree with you, i would never in my life wish i was rich. The way i see it is, your poor barely getting by but happy, Or you can be rich and have lots of problems in life and not be happy. Alot of people think money can buy happinies. I dont think so. I use to live in mexico, pretty shitty life style if you ask me.

I would rather be scrapping be happy enjoying life than be rich any day of the week. It might be hard but we all have our trials.

also i think good will forgive us who cant make it to church. I have to work sundays no exceptions. It sucks but what can i do? quit my job? i dont think so!