Read this GTR horror story.

[jhoff]

Here are the cliff notes for anyone who doesn’t want to read the entire detailed experience”

• 22 month project
• Over $250,000 spent at Forged Performance
• Countless lies and broken promises
• 300 whp below goal
• Engine failure before delivery
• Transmission failure shortly after delivery
• 2nd Engine failure upon teardown
• Hacked up turbo kit
• Overcharged for the performed work
• Horrible craftsmanship
• Shoddy work
• FP refused to compensate me for the troubles or refund me

I dropped my car off to start my project with Forged Performance back on March 3rd of 2011. I had originally intended to build this project in a couple of stages because I wanted to enjoy my car over the summer. I already had all of the basic bolt on modifications as well as a stock frame AMS turbo upgrade, and a moderately modified transmission with upgraded clutches, but I wanted a noticeable power increase over what I was currently making. All of the previous work was also done at Forged Performance. After discussing the project with Sharif, he recommended the HKS GT800 turbo kit. We had planned to keep the motor and transmission untouched for the time being as the car would be making its way back up to Forged in the fall for the engine and a full transmission build.

The whole review is here.
http://www.gtrlife.com/forums/topic/...nce-the-truth/

[lucifer1]

The guy who owns the car must have a crapload of money to waste. I didn't read the whole thing but spending the first 80,000 seems ridiculous. Then looking at the pictures, it is a standard import shop install. If you want high quality work you need to find high quality people. Money doesn't always equal common sense.

[deevergote]

$250,000 in all is what he spent on that shop, he said! Absolutely insane.
I would draw the line at the first sign of incompetence, honestly.

[MikeW]

Where do I begin? Lol. Not surprised it's located in GA. Flame all you want but I never see or hear about anything good coming from that state or that part of the country.

And how does this guy have all that money and all that knowledge of parts, etc and has it taken to a shop? Sounds like he was either looking for something cheap, which is what he got, or he didnt wanna go to the same shop(s) as everyone else.

And maybe IDK shit about "real" performance cars but since when does it take a shop months to install a turbo kit?

[Ralphie]

Where do I begin? Lol. Not surprised it's located in GA. Flame all you want but I never see or hear about anything good coming from that state or that part of the country.

And how does this guy have all that money and all that knowledge of parts, etc and has it taken to a shop? Sounds like he was either looking for something cheap, which is what he got, or he didnt wanna go to the same shop(s) as everyone else.

And maybe IDK shit about "real" performance cars but since when does it take a shop months to install a turbo kit?

I don't agree with the GA comment, that is quite a generalization.


As far as the shop, they saw a sucker and they sucked him dry.

My wife has never lifted a wrench in her life, and she could figure out how to install a turbo in less then a month if she wanted too.

They knew what they were doing.

[rexload]

OVER 1/4 of a million spent on mods?
Excuse my ignorance, but how do you spend that much?
Is 100K of that labor?

I mean a turbo kit is a turbo kit. Custom manifold(s?) are what, about 1K a piece to fab?
Turbos, intercooler, bovs, wastegates, plumbing is MAYBE 10K
Fuel system, gauges and engine management and dyno tune = maybe another 10K
Engine and tranny work (pardon my ignorance once again) is MAYBE 50-60K..
Suspension and tires is maybe 7K

So that's still under 100 grand.
How do you even spend that much money?

[deevergote]

I like the GTR, but really... $80-100k for the car, then $250k in mods. Overall, about $350,000 for the car.

I'd rather spend $250,000 for a 458 Italia, and drop $100,000 into making THAT faster.

[TypeG]

lol. nothing good from Ga.

that shop is really close to me and i know some of the dudes. they have modded many gtr's, so they get the joke when it comes to modifying them. guess every shop has it's bad story. later.

[deevergote]

That one is pretty extreme, though...

Of course, we're only hearing one side. I mean, if the guy was dumb enough to keep throwing money at a shop that was pissing him off at every turn, he couldn't possibly be 100% innocent in the whole situation either!

[TypeG]

yeah, it is pretty bad. there's good and bad guys at every shop from what i've seen. i'd be curious to hear their side as well. of course i could just get in the car and go ask them, lol. later.

[jhoff]

Shops response

For those that have been patient and allow me to respond, I appreciate it. This is one of the busiest weeks for Forged Performance each year, with both OLOA and ZDAYZ happening over the next two weeks. When I was first informed of this thread by my staff, it was 3 pages long, and in just a few hours it's grown to 12. I advised my staff, customers, and friends to refrain from posting until I've had a chance to post my reply. In addition to reading Boxster's post carefully, I also skimmed through some of the comments. The review jumps around so I will do my best to respond. I will likely need to follow up with additional posts, some pictures and commentary of my own and so forth.

Todd's review is uncharacteristic of the type of work we perform here at Forged, because much of it isn't true and those that have done business with us know this. I started Forged back in 2004, and I've been an active part of the Nissan community for almost a decade. The body of our work and contributions to the community speaks for itself. We have almost 5000 happy customers and we continue to improve our level of service and performance each year. I acknowledge that we make mistakes from time to time but we are quick to make things right to the best of our ability. In areas where we've fallen short, I'll do whatever it takes to insure that our customers are happy. Clearly, Todd points out some areas where we have done a poor job. Those who performed this work are no longer working at Forged.

Unfortunately in this case with Todd, instead of allowing us to address every one of his concerns and issues at no charge, he elected to take his car to another shop. Not just any shop, but a shop with extreme animosity towards Forged Performance due to a employee/employer litigation that is still going. He then demanded a refund. If I didn't give him a refund, he told me it would get "ugly"...his words...not mine. He told me he would write a negative review and discredit me and my company. Since I don't negotiate when someone threatens me, I find myself here on the the public forums to share my side of this story. It's important that you all understand the context and some of the back-story that precipitated this post. First, Todd did not personally write this review. Someone wrote it on his behalf so let me clarify some of the missed points.

First, Todd did NOT spend $250K on this build. He has spent $250K with Forged over the past 4 years including 3 different builds, plus a couple sets of wheels, and tons of misc parts over the past FOUR years.

It's been said several times, that Todd's car took 22 months to complete. What he failed to point out, is that more than half of this delay was related to decisions that Todd made on the build plan for his car and changes that were made as we progressed. Cars that come to Forged with a defined and straightforward build plan are in and out very quickly. We preorder parts, segregate space in the shop and production calendar in order to minimize the turnaround time. But in the case of Todd's build, there was a constant stop/start process and parts changes and new directions that were initiated by the CUSTOMER...not by Forged. For instance, Todds car was up and running last summer. But after talking things over with Todd, he decided to wait on the Motec which we were told was just a few weeks out. I never said that a Motec is required, as I'd already tuned numerous cars into the 1000hp range with the Cobb AP. But MoTec offered some key features that Todd wanted and I was excited to tune the car with it. Ultimately, the decision is made by the customer, and we should not be blamed for that 6 month delay.

After building and tuning the car with the GT800 kit, Todd made the decision to have us build the engine, transmission and upgrade his turbos. After a few weeks went by, he then decided he wanted to go for REALLY big power. Keep in mind this was after we already sent the turbos off for upgrading which caused another 3 month delay. When we got the upgraded GT800 turbos back, then Todd changed his mind again and decided he wanted a turbo kit capable of 1200-1300whp with room to grow. When we discussed turbo kit options, the only other big turbo options were the Alpha 12, and the Boost Logic kits. (ETS big kits were not on the market back then). We determined that the Jun kit was the largest turbo kit currently available, running the big full size GTX35. Alpha 12 and Boost logic were on backorder several weeks, so we ordered the Jun kit. The Jun kit arrives and we wrap up Todd's engine. As we start unpacking and installing the turbo kit, we quickly realize that the kit is designed for a RHD GT-R. I immediately call Junichi at Jun, and he apologizes and said we can send the kit back for a refund. After I update Todd, I tell him we have a few options including returning the kit. But Todd didn't want wait for several more weeks until we could get a BL or AMS kit. So I told him we could modify the kit to fit a LHD car. He understood this would require quite a bit of additional labor (which I discounted by 50%), and would require permanent modifications to the kit and car. In the pictures he posted, BTW, those spacers on the exhaust and the chassis brace are NOT needed and were mistakenly left on the car during the mock-up stages.

The next point I want to address is the transmission. The transmission we built for him did not fail due to anything we did improperly. Todd's transmission broke due to a defective 4th gear, according to Todd himself. The manufacturer has agreed to supply a new gear. In fact over the phone, he said that he can't blame Forged for the transmission so I am curious why he is bringing this up on the thread.. I am sure something probably got lost in translation when the third part wrote this review. The clutches were installed correctly, as were the piston seals. The Promax clutch case can back out under loads so we apply a couple of spot welds to prevent this from happening. Dodson has since resigned the Promax seal threads so this process doesn't need to be done anymore.

With respect the engine build, yes, the first engine spun a bearing prior to delivery. The person who assembled that engine no longer works for Forged, and we see this as a good thing. The spun bearing was determined to be a combination of slightly tighter bearing clearances than we spec out, and lack of oil priming. All of our engines are primed with oil before we ever start the engine. This process was not done on your first engine. With regards to your first and second engine, the pistons were installed correctly. Perhaps your current shop should contact Arias so they can understand which way those arrows should face. I am in the process of inspecting your block, and I can assure you they are installed correctly. Todd was told that the oil pan was full of metal. I told Todd that is not possible as we changed the oil and cut open his oil filter before and after tuning which is our standard practice. Although I am not completely done with the short block inspection, there appears to be no signs of metal in the oil whatsoever. Yes, the sleeves have shifted and I will have the root cause of this in a few days. We stand behind our engines so if a machining error was made this will be addressed. To keep things moving, I have already provided a brand new OEM block and crank to Todd's current shop at no charge. If those of you reading this thread think that engines don't occasionally fail at other shops, you should think again. It's extremely rare, but it can happen. I think our engine track record both stock and built, is among the best in the industry. But I am trying to understand why Todd would tell me that his current shop said that the oil pan was "full of metal" when we see no signs at all of metal on this engine. His shop also performed a compression and leakdown test prior to engine removal and the engine checked out healthy.

Finally here is the email I sent Todd, even after he threatened to "go public" with his story.


Todd, we expect our customers to allow us to address any issues they may have with their car. This is a fundamental expectation that customers have with their tuning shop, and vice versa. If you have lost faith in us, that is your choice, but I cannot reimburse you for a complete turbo kit because you have changed your mind or want someone else to work on your car. You knew all throughout the process, that significant modifications would be needed to be made to make the kit fit a LHD drive car. The reason we used this kit, is because there were no other kits on the market that would meet your goals for power at the time we ordered the kit. Boost logic was months out, ETS wasn’t even making kits this large, Alpha 12 was too small [for the future power levels Todd wanted]. Yes, today, there are plenty of options, but that was not the case more than a year ago. You agreed with this process and were kept well informed as we proceeded. And I covered more than half of the costs associated with modifying the kit to fit. It made almost 1050whp on E85 at very mild boost levels.

I have always made every effort to provide excellent support and customer service. We talked and texted literally on a daily and sometimes hourly basis over the past few years. I cannot change how you feel about our work…I’ve already tried that. Regrettably, you have threatened to go public with some photos and your experience if I don’t return your turbo kit. I don’t like to be threatened or lied to, and you’ve done both. You assisted one of our competitors by providing confidential emails and other information that could use used to harm my company in a separate legal action unrelated to you. This does not sound like a customer or a friend that is trying to work towards a good-will resolution. I will use all resources possible to defend my company name and reputation that I have worked hard for 8 years to create. I would urge you to reconsider and let’s come up with a reasonable solution for this and move forward.

It doesn't go unnoticed that most of the people posting in Todd's thread have already made up their minds. But hopefully those that have an open mind, will see that standing behind work, requires the cooperation of the customer as well, and people working in good faith to come to a resolution. Unfortunately, Todd has decided to go a different direction. I even offered to address all issues and pay for a third party inspection when we were done. I will do my best to answer any legitimate questions posed. I hope we can all have cool heads and have a civilized discussion about this rather than personal attacks on me, and the company I've spent almost a decade building.

[h22sparkle]

Man that shit was bananas regular clamps and not t-bolt clamps and half-fast work along with broken shit on there. The hell with that .

[deevergote]

Very well written, and not overly defensive. I'm inclined to think that Todd is indeed overdramatizing things.

[Jarrett]

The familiarity of this situation is astounding. Albeit on a scale of about 1/250th of this.

[deevergote]

Makes me think of Bisimoto, only Todd isn't being called a "hater", or other random nameless and faceless "haters" being blamed for the shop's soiled reputation.