The Obama Deception HQ Full length version

[Straight Success]

Obama isn't Clinton. He is already outspending those three together. Fact. Not fiction.

Clinton got head for free. I don't blame him. I mean, yeahhe cheated on Hillary. I don't condone that, but the presidency is a tough job. He had to relax somehow.

Aside from that, the 3 trillion Bush spent on the benifitted who? Mainly his causes and gripes, not America. That was ~3 trillion wasted on Iraq.

Obama spending directly is targeted to help America, not his own causes. It's for the American's. Again look what the money is being spent on. It's not like when Bush was in office. He never cared about anyone who was below upper middle class. Obama cares about 'EVERYONE'...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obama-B...sition_Project

Scott, all of your Obama budget links are only estimates. They are trying to predict the outcomes in terms of dollar figures. We can't predict the future numbers. We have to wait until they role in. We can only look at the 2009 numbers, not future predictions because it can fluctuate in either direction.

[HybridKyle]

You are misinterpreting the role of the Federal Reserve.

They make decisions on how much it costs to borrow money, and to try and maintain a minimal amount of inflation. That is their primary function. To some degree, they are supposed to insure liquidity, but they are also supposed to interfere as little as possible in free market operations.

They use certain guidelines for decision making. They don't just make economic decisions from the hip. It is a VERY complex process.

The problem was caused by greedy Americans who want to blame everyone else for their stupid decisions. Nobody made the Americans leverage themselves to the hilt, and nobody made them take out bad debt. It just didn't work that way.

The Credit default swap market that brought everything down was completely unregulated. The Federal Reserve had no authority to stop it. The SEC should probably have had control of that because they were more "investments" than money. But they didn't have the authority either.

As for the subprime lending, that should have fallen under the auspices of the FDIC, one of whose jobs is to ensure that banks remain liquid.

The fact is that American people wanted to get more than they could afford, more than they needed, because they were greedy. And as with any group of people whose greed exceeds their means, they got exactly what they deserved.

The Federal Reserve did make some improper estimations and assessments on things, and Alan Greenspan has already talked about where he screwed up and what he did wrong, but isn't it always easier to be an armchair quarterback, than the person making the decision at that moment?

http://www.fdic.gov/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FDIC

http://www.sec.gov/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEC

I WILL, but haven't yet read all this yet...

BUT,

We owe the Fed Reserve right at 50% of our total debt correct?
When YOU, as a single person, owe a bank money, is it not them that calls all the shots? Them that make all the rules, have all the fine print?
How is it then that they are not controlling it all? They are not in this to try and make everything better for everyone else...what bank has ever done anything for the greater good? They are in this for MONEY, plain and simple. They print money from thin air basically and loan it to the US with interest.

The Fed runs the show

Can you tell me all the people on the board? Who they work for and where they come from? What their agendas are? This is a serious question, due to the fact that the chairman is just the public face, not the decision maker. Just as with any other company, the board runs it.

I am going to read your links, and be back later...Thanks!

[Straight Success]

His spending is trying to move us forward as a whole. Not for his personal pockets, or any of his political associates pockets.

http://www.gop.com/obamaspendometer.htm

http://www.usatoday.com/money/econom...-economy_N.htm

[Straight Success]

Now, I have to go back and fully read every link in detail. It's a lot of inforamtion which is good.

[HybridKyle]

I've read many articles which suggest the recovery is here and the recession is near or at the end. I've read others that state it may take a little while longer. From what I've seen, I can attest to both argumets. Some people feel that the recession is over and others don't. It's in many of the links already posted.



Your emotional. What went on in Iraq did not affect America. Point blank. Slavery did, it was here in America. Of course if that was my family, it effects me. I'm a part of it. We don't major ties to Iraq beside business. Their government or ours for that matter has no effect on eachother's policies inside each country. Bad stuff happens in many countries that we have no control over. Cuba and Castro for example. Who are we to say that another country has to abide by our laws?



No... I'll help a stranger in a minute, so long as it does not affect my well being. Again common sense. Also I would help if I was a fire fighter or some other type of heroic act for a good cause that would benifit someone else.



No. The halocaust is not the reason WWII broke out. It started because Hitler was trying to bully everyone and take over many countries (New world order under Hitler). The world didn't like that plan. The halocaust is not what started it. We went to war mainly because of Pearl Harbor.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. You are wayyyyy toooo
emotional.

1. So what you are saying is that you go along with whatever the newest article is that fits your point of view for the moment. You don't really know what is what, and you have said it a couple of times yourself.

2. I AM emotional, thats what happens when you care about your fellow man, country, society. That is someones family out there, might not be yours, but it's someones. I lost friends out there, friends from THAT COUNTRY, friends from this country. Where were you? What have you done? Ohhh, thats right, by your standards basically no one should stand up for anyone other than their own family right? So, bye bye military, local police force, pretty much any part of the government that protects you DAY TO DAY...bring everything back that was ever undone by war, going to fight for people that were not my family was a waist of my time, sweat, blood & tears. Thanks for proving my point again about being selfish, you and allot of the country

Let me say it like this, IF something like this were to happen to someone in your family and others were there WATCHING it but not doing anything about it, are they not just as guilty? Would you not be disappointed in the fact that no one came to help them when they needed it most? Or would you be okay with that just because they weren't in your family or doesn't directly affect you? Basically you would help if you got PAID to help...lol...thats your good cause. Because regardless of being a civil servant or not, if you help someone it benefits them.

3. I never said WWII was based on the holocaust, but YOU said that no one ever stood up for those people and yet again, someone proved you wrong and now you are changing your argument on a subject YOU mentioned, WWII, but not that I also proved you wrong with slavery...?

Pick and choose away...have a good day sir

[Straight Success]

Response to post #141, #3. Your original words.

Are you serious about not helping in the holocaust OR SLAVERY BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA
Guess you haven't had a history class...EVER?
Uhhmmm the major WAR World War II WAS about the holocaust, what do you think it was about? Oil? Money? Ulterior motives? Jesus man, you might want to go back through Elem. and Middle school to get some BASIC facts and knowledge.

Actually I am learning a bit here. Obama is spending a lot, more than anybody before him. I grant you and Scott for making that a full reality. The fact of the matter is, he is doing it for good reasons, and to better the country. He's doing this to fix this '^%^&* &^(*^ ' nation and the problems that come along with it; problems he did not create. it's going to get better and he will eventually lower the debt. It's only been 7 months.

I applaud you for standing tall for 'OUR' country. I definitely would do it if I was needed. My reality and yours are very different. I do care about the next man or woman, but as I stated before, I can't engage in a situation which I have no knowledge about or doesn't serve a logical purpose without endangering myself. War, only if it was necessary. I'm emotional at times, but I've learned or am learning how to curb it. I can't fix the world neither can you. We just have to make a little bit of progress here and there until everything becomes better. I'm form a low income community in Philadelphia, which means I know how to help people. It's basically how 'WE" survive, helping one another.

[HybridKyle]

Response to post #141, #3. Your original words.



Actually I am learning a bit here. Obama is spending a lot, more than anybody before him. I grant you and Scott for making that a full reality. The fact of the matter is, he is doing it for good reasons, and to better the country. He's doing this to fix this '^%^&* &^(*^ ' nation and the problems that come along with it; problems he did not create. it's going to get better and he will eventually lower the debt. It's only been 7 months.

I applaud you for standing tall for 'OUR' country. I definitely would do it if I was needed. My reality and yours are very different. I do care about the next man or woman, but as I stated before, I can't engage in a situation which I have no knowledge about or doesn't serve a logical purpose without endangering myself. War, only if it was necessary. I'm emotional at times, but I've learned or am learning how to curb it. I can't fix the world neither can you. We just have to make a little bit of progress here and there until everything becomes better. I'm form a low income community in Philadelphia, which means I know how to help people. It's basically how 'WE" survive, helping one another.

So, I am a low income family too, and...? So I know also, but that doesn't mean I walk around acting like it or blaming everyone else.

My thing is that we cannot have the mentality that doing for other people is bad. The war DID/IS costing allot of money, but it's not over yet either, and Obama is now the president, so we will see. You cannot speculate that things would be better if the war never happened. And if we are not helping people, on ALL levels, then we will never get that little bit of progress that you just spoke of. It doesn't come from thin air.

Look at Owequitit's sig... read it, understand it...

Obama didn't even serve a full term in the senate and is now the President...he wasn't forced into this position, he asked for it, so stop defending him, he is supposedly a big boy now. If he wasn't ready for the burden or situation then he shouldn't have stepped up. But he did, and now it's his. He is learning and making his mistakes as the president, not as a senator, and I don't think thats the best thing for the American people. But thats my opinion, and I have nothing to back that up...we will just have to see what it's like to have a unseasoned politician as a president.

AND Yes, I did say that...but that was in response to you saying that no one ever stood up for the holocaust, when they did. Plain and simple, the holocaust was stopped because of the WWII

[owequitit]

Clinton got head for free. I don't blame him. I mean, yeahhe cheated on Hillary. I don't condone that, but the presidency is a tough job. He had to relax somehow.

Aside from that, the 3 trillion Bush spent on the benifitted who? Mainly his causes and gripes, not America. That was ~3 trillion wasted on Iraq.

Clinton's penchant for blow jobs has nothing to do with anything. This is a diversionary tactic on your hand.

This is one of the fundamental flaws in your entire mentallity. You are still consistently trying to justify Obama's shortcomings by pointing to Bush. Bush is out of office. He has been for 8 months now. I could honestly give a fuck what Bush does or did. There is no way to change where we are now, and I want solutions MOVING FOWARD. I don't want lame ass excuses from an Obama fanboy about how Obama's mis-steps are OK because Bush fucked up. Two wrongs don't make a right, and two stupids doesn't make a smart.

Period.

Obama spending directly is targeted to help America, not his own causes. It's for the American's. Again look what the money is being spent on. It's not like when Bush was in office. He never cared about anyone who was below upper middle class. Obama cares about 'EVERYONE'...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obama-B...sition_Project

Bullshit. If Obama cared about everyone he wouldn't be trying to cram through legislation that is unpopular and needs more time to be worked out as a broadly amicable solution. If Obama cared about everyone, he wouldn't be trying to create a false budget about how much it is going to cost. If he really cared about future generations, he wouldn't be spending trillions of dollars we don't have. Period. Obama is a policitian. All Obama cares about is his political career, just like every other politician on the face of the planet. The fact that he whispers sweet nothings in your ear, and you believe them, is inconsequential to me.

For the record, you have posted about 5 links, about 3 of which were informative. There were two for some rap video, and 1 for something about holocaust, which means there were actually about 6. The other 1 or two were outdated news articles that no longer have ANY bearing on reality.

The thing you apparently still need to get out of school, is what constitutes a credible link, and what does not. I hope you figure that out before you actually ever have to publish or create something that requires peer review, because as it is, you will fail miserably. You have been given 7 pages to post something substantive and argueable, and you have yet to do so. Also, for the record, Wikipedia is really not a credible source, which is why I generally include the official link with it, so you better be careful about using it, or at least verifying all of the references, which I am sure you didn't do. It is all about verification. The TRUE scientific process is that you can justify, explain and re-create that which you created, and anybody else can also recreate it with the same exact data, information, tools, or processes. This thread was an opportunity to actually practice that process, and you have not succeeded.

All you have consistently done is perpetuate the rhetoric of all other biased political parties by running around and around the same issues by trying to point to the failings of someone you don't like. I want ANSWERS. You have done nothing to shore up your support.

Scott, all of your Obama budget links are only estimates. They are trying to predict the outcomes in terms of dollar figures. We can't predict the future numbers. We have to wait until they role in. We can only look at the 2009 numbers, not future predictions because it can fluctuate in either direction.

You're serious aren't you?

LOL.

I am not even going to respond to this other than to say, you need some kind of accounting, finance, business, economic education. You would do well for yourself to try on some of those types of classes.


You have been given plenty of opportunity to create a sustainable and justified viewpoint, and you have failed to do so. Just remember that the next time you criticize someone else's viewpoint that you think it unwarranted.

This has also started to lean towards a flame-fest, and thus has outlived its usefullness. I was hoping to be able to have a discussion on opposing viewpoints, but clearly that isn't going to happen.