California to ban black cars?

[Losiracer2]

I live in Arizona and most of the air around here is pristine, and we have no emmissions at all.

well actually in AZ there are emissions, just in certain parts there aren't any guidelines regulating those rules. In Chandler and Scottsdale I know there are for sure. I have to go every 2 years. But its far less strict then CA is for sure.

[zack_odom]

Your smog tech is wrong.

Each state regulates their own pollution regulations, but they can't be LESS than the mandated EPA standards. If a state (Cali for instance) wants to have standards ABOVE the EPA, they are allowed to, however it is not required. California or the EPA can also not REQUIRE other states to follow their regulations. Each state is sovereign and has rights equal to that of every other state.

However, if the car maker CHOOSES to sell the same car that meets the highest emmission standards in every state, that is also acceptable but not required.

Often, the manufacturer's will sell two versions. One for those states that adopt California's standards, and one for everyone else.

Also, just as a note for those who think the world revolves around southern California, it doesn't.

The reason So Cal needs to have ridiculously strict emmissions laws is because they try and cram 20 million + people into a region designed to support 5 million tops. Aside from the poor environmental implications of that, with normal emmissions regs, people would choke to death. Couple that with mountain ranges that don't allow the pollution to circulate, and you have a recipe for disaster.

However, quite frankly, outside of the more spread out large metro areas in other states, the emmissions standards of California are neither required nor sensible. I live in Arizona and most of the air around here is pristine, and we have no emmissions at all.

I find it comical that the area that is worst in trying to make an environment support more than it can universally claims to have the solutions to the world's environmental problems. The fact is that if LA/San Diego etc weren't so overpopulated, they wouldn't have as much trouble as they do in a lot of enviromental areas. They also then just assume that everyone else has the same environmental problems and thus should universally adopt their "solutions."

Thank you.

[Fake Thug]

lol quitit is stickin it to those cali snobs(pow take that cali legislature)..

[mozzandherb]

I just want to know WHO THE FUCK comes up with these BULLSHIT
car legislations....

The people who drive around in their SUV's, that's who

[Ralphie]

This thread is pretty ridiculous.

You guys will find anything to argue about.

And i agree, while the west coast might have a lot to offer, it is not the most desirable state in the country, it never has been, and never will be. So just accept it.

[MikeW]

Id like to quote...

...it can be cooled down immediately by driving a few feet with the windows open, effectively neutralizing any color-caused heat issues before engaging the air conditioner.

Black or white is only for visual spectrum EM wave absorption. For IR heat rays, how shiny/dull the car is - is all that matters. An ounce for non-science people.

.

[tomas]

"I'll be back"

[avaaj]

You got to be joking!
Am I the only one who think this is stupid??

[TheNextEpisode]

Who cares what will happen in 2013. The world is ending in 2012, don't you guys know that?

You got to be joking!
Am I the only one who think this is stupid??

Judging by the last 5 pages, you are not the only one who thinks this is stupid.
Based on your comment, the last 5 pages weren't really interesting enough to read.

[DRzCB72nr]

Who cares what will happen in 2013. The world is ending in 2012, don't you guys know that?

x2

[HenRoc]

In that case...New Hampshire rules..you all suck...at least we live with the motto ' Live Free or Die' .

What other state do you know uses that exact motto?

[wed3k]

This thread is pretty ridiculous.

You guys will find anything to argue about.

And i agree, while the west coast might have a lot to offer, it is not the most desirable state in the country, it never has been, and never will be. So just accept it.

my sig says it all. if you've never been, then please shut up.

[owequitit]

well actually in AZ there are emissions, just in certain parts there aren't any guidelines regulating those rules. In Chandler and Scottsdale I know there are for sure. I have to go every 2 years. But its far less strict then CA is for sure.

Please reread the post.

"Outside of the large spread out metro areas."

I am well aware of the emmissions testing in Phoenix and Tucson. There isn't any anywhere else.

And the reason those two places need it is because "people" (I won't be any less generalized than that) are moving in and doing the same shit they did in their previous locations. They are putting too many people in too small of an area, and then complaining about air pollution and water shortages, and they try and thrust and force their beliefs and solutions down everyone else's throats, when the REAL solution would have been for them not to move into such a small space in the first place.

I have been in and around AZ my whole life, and I have watched it grow more populated and more polluted, and more distressed environmentally, and more populated, more distressed and more polluted. As this has occured, more and more "environmentally concerned" people are trying to tell me how I need to adjust MY life so that they can continue to cram ever more people into an ever dwindling open space. I know they are full of shit, because I actually study science and I have seen first hand the before and after pictures.

10 years ago, your house was covered in lush green orange groves that produced some of the best Citrus in the country. 20 years ago, there wasn't an air pollution problem in Phoenix and Tucson. 20 years ago, there weren't major water shortages because 10 million people were trying to live on the water supply of 1 million people. Oddly, as cars have gotten several orders of magnitudes cleaner, we have somehow managed to destroy the environment even more. Isn't that odd. Clearly the solution is to make cars "greener."

The simple fact is that if you put too much pressure on an ecosystem, it WILL fail.

[owequitit]

my sig says it all. if you've never been, then please shut up.

I have been. Been all up and down California. It is a nice state in several key areas. But it is not the end all be all place on Earth.

I would suspect that perhaps others have "never been."

[TheNextEpisode]

10 years ago, your house was covered in lush green orange groves that produced some of the best Citrus in the country. 20 years ago, there wasn't an air pollution problem in Phoenix and Tucson. 20 years ago, there weren't major water shortages because 10 million people were trying to live on the water supply of 1 million people. Oddly, as cars have gotten several orders of magnitudes cleaner, we have somehow managed to destroy the environment even more. Isn't that odd. Clearly the solution is to make cars "greener."

The simple fact is that if you put too much pressure on an ecosystem, it WILL fail.

An argument against that, though, is in the childhood memories of my dad and his friends. They grew up near downtown LA back in the late 50's and early 60's. They clearly remember not being allowed to go out to recess because the air quality was so bad. Running for more than 20 minutes at a time would leave you heaving for oxygen, and not just carbon monoxide, and burning eyes weren't uncommon. Now, LA is obviously much larger (admittedly far too large) and yet the air quality is FAR better.

And I don't think cars have suffered too much since the 50's due to emissions regulations, despite the complaints put up by the big 3 in the 70s.


Don't get me wrong, though. I definitely agree with the population factor of emissions control. Waste and water management in LA is a humongous problem, specifically due to population. I hate driving 50 miles out from downtown LA and landing in some disgustingly uniform tract home development. And, it makes me even more sick when I realize that every person living in those far-too-large houses now has to drive (and of course polluting) 15 miles to get to a grocery store or a community worth being in.

A large part of pollution problems would be quelled with a smaller population, but its awfully hard to ask a percentage of LA to walk off a pier.